DECEMBER, 1811.

Foreign Relations.

H. OF R.

From this view of the subject, the committee beg leave to recommend the adoption of the following resolution:

Resolved, That the prayer of the petition is unreasonable, and ought not to be granted.

FOREIGN RELATIONS.

The House resumed the consideration of the report of the Committee of Foreign Relations. The question being on the agreement to the second resolution, authorizing the raising an additional regular force

Mr. GRUNDY, as a member of the committee stated his impression that this was the vital part of the report; and although he had no desire to prolong debate, invited those who were opposed to the report now to come forward and state their objections to it.

That the petitioners state, that Gustavus Upton, in October, 1807, purchased, in France, sundry articles of merchandise, which, in the month of February, 1808, were shipped in the Ceres, for New York, and the voyage commenced, but which was relanded in consequence of information received, that the British Government had issued orders for the capture of all American vessels bound to or from the ports of France. That no safe opportunity offering for the conveyance of the merchandise to the United States, in December, 1808, when one of the petitioners (Gustavus Upton) left France for Great Britain; having previously given instructions to Messrs. McCarthy and Brothers of Bordeaux to ship the merchandise to the United States directly, if a conveyance could be obtained; and, if not, to forward the same to England, whence, it was supposed, the merchandise might be shipped to the United States, with ease and safety. The petitioners further state, that, on the 12th of April, 1809, a conveyance was engaged for the said merchandise for London, in the ship Yaug Fran Agena Sophia, of Mr. RANDOLPH said, he was an old-fashioned Kniphausen. On the merchandise arriving in the port politician. In the days of terror, we shrunk at of London, liberty to land the same, for sale, was re- standing armies; and what is the object nowfused, but granted to reship it for the United States; defence? Who? Freemen who would not dewhich was done in June, 1809, on board the Rhadius, fend themselves. He would ask, if seven millions Captain Farly, for New York, and reached that port of Americans were to be protected in their lives on the 18th of October, 1809, in contravention of and liberties by ten thousand vagabonds who were the act of Congress, entitled "An act to interdict the fit food for gunpowder? It would be necessary to commercial intercourse between the United States and know the ulterior views of the committee on this Great Britain and France, and their dependencies, and point. It would be proper, before a vote was taken for other purposes," passed the 1st of March, 1809. on this resolution, to know for what purpose these The petitioners further state, that, on the arrival of additional troops were wanted. The House ought the said merchandise at New York, they gave notice not to commit itself on a question of such magnithereof to the collector, and that they had no intention tude without detailed information. He was as of violating any law; that the merchandise, notwith-much opposed to raising standing armies now, as standing the fair and open procedure of the petition- be had been in the reign of terror. He had seen ers, was taken into the custody of the revenue officers, too much of the corruptions attendant on these esand that, on a petition to the Secretary of the Treas-tablishments, in the course of the investigation in ury, in conformity to the act, entitled "An act to provide for mitigating or remitting the forfeitures, penalties, and disabilities accruing in certain cases therein mentioned," he decided that the said merchandise should be delivered to the petitioners, on their payment of costs, double duties on the articles imported contrary to law, and a sum equal to the extra duties imposed by this decision, for the use of the custom house officers at New York; with which decision the petitioners complied. They now pray the National Legislature that the sums of money which they have been made to pay, over and above the legal duties, may be refunded.

case.

The committee can see no great hardship in this The merchandise seized was prohibited, and the whole importation, had a prosecution been instituted, would have been condemned as an importation contravening the provisions of the act, entitled "An act to interdict the commercial intercourse between the United States and Great Britain and France and their dependencies, and for other purposes," passed the 1st day of March, 1809. The petitioners or shippers must have known that the merchandise was liable to seizure prior to the shipment of the same at London for the United States, the shipment having taken place more than three months subsequent to the passage of the abovementioned act.

So far from being liable to the charge of rigor in the application of law to the petitioners' case, the committee are of opinion that the Secretary of the Treasury exercised the powers with which he is by law invested, with great moderation.

which he was engaged, not to disclaim all share in
the creation of them. The people of the United
States could defend themselves, if necessary, and
had no idea of resting their defence on mercena-
ries, picked up from brothels and tippling houses-
pickpockets who have escaped from Newgate, &c.,
and sought refuge in this asylum of oppressed hu-
manity. He contended that this resolution con-
tained an unconstitutional proposition, and that
the standing army now in the service of the United
States was maintained in the very teeth of that
part of the Constitution which declares that no
money for the support of a standing army should
be appropriated for more than two years.
again called for information as to the object of the
army now proposed to be raised; declaring, that,
if the President should say they were necessary
for the protection of New Orleans, to be employed
against the Indians, or to repel incursions from
Canada, (although this seemed not to be much
thought of,) he should not refuse to grant them,
He declared the report to be a negative position,
which could not be combated except to disadvan-
tage. He wished to know the Constitutional
resources of the committee, and expressed a hope
that the remarks he had made would draw out the
talents of that body.

He

Mr. GRUNDY.-I did not expect that the gentleman from Virginia would have made any inquiries into the motives or objects of that committee

of which he himself was a member. He, sir, attended faithfully to his duty, and witnessed every step the committee took. He also saw the report before it was made to this House, and must have heard the exposition of our ulterior measures, as explained by our Chairman. Why, then, sir, shall he now affect not to understand us? Our object, by those who will listen, shall not be misunderstood. And, Mr. Speaker, as I have no political secrets, I feel no hesitation in declaring to you, to this House, and to the nation, the view I have taken of the subject. But before I do this, it is due to the committee that an explanation of their conduct should take place.

So soon as the Committee on our Foreign Relations was appointed, we were forcibily impressed with the serious and highly responsible station you had assigned us; to that committee, consisting of nine members only, were not only the eyes of this House but of the nation turned; and from us, in this, the most troubled season our world has ever known, was it expected, that a course of measures would be recommended, cal culated to protect the interests of seven millions of people. Under this impression, Mr. Speaker, we deemed it a duty to take time for deliberation; we thought it better to encounter the charge of having acted in a tardy and dilatory way, than to take a rash step, by which this nation might be plunged into difficulties, from which it could not be easily extricated. We therefore took the necessary time to weigh the arguments both for and against the measures we have recommended; and, as far as we were able, we surveyed the consequences which were to follow from the course we proposed. We foresaw, Mr. Speaker, that our countrymen were to fall in the meditated conflict, and that American blood was to stream afresh. Nor were we unmindful of the expenditure of public treasure. And, sir, what cost me more reflection than everything else was the new test to which we are to put this Government. We are about to ascertain by actual experiment how far our Republican institutions are calculated to stand the shock of war, and whether, after foreign danger disappeared, we can again assume our peaceful attitude, without endangering the liberties of the people.

DECEMBER, 1811.

and present an undivided front to the enemies of our country.

Republicans should never forget that some years ago a set of men of different politics held the reins of this Government, and drove the car of State; they were charged with being friendly to standing armies in times of peace, and favorable to expensive establishments; not for the purpose of opposing foreign enemies, but to encourage Executive patronage, and to bring these forces to operate upon the people themselves. These measures alarmed the Republicans; they remon strated, they clamored, they appealed to the peo ple, and by a national sentence, the men then in power were taken down from their high places, and Republican men were put in their seats.

If your minds are resolved on war, you are consistent, you are right, you are still Republicans; but if you are not resolved, pause and reflect, for should this resolution pass, and you then become faint-hearted, remember that you have abandoned your old principles, and trod in the paths of your predecessors.

According to my view of this subject, Mr. Speaker, we now stand on the bank; one movement more, the Rubicon is passed, we are in Italy, and we must march to Rome.

As a member of the committee, I feel no hesitation in saying, that if there be a member here, not determined to go with us, to the extent of our measures, I prefer now to take my leave of him, rather then be deserted when the clouds darken, and the storm thickens upon us.

This admonition I owed to candor-I have paid it, not because I doubted; my purpose is settled, my mind reposes upon it. I may be in an error. If I am, I hope my country will forgive me. From my God I shall never need it, because he knows the purity of my motives.

I will now state the reasons which influenced the committee, in recommending the measures now before us.

It is not the carrying trade, properly so called, about which this nation and Great Britain are at present contending. Were this the only question now under consideration, I should feel great unwillingness (however clear our claim might be) to involve the nation in war, for the asser. Against these considerations, weighty in them- community at large are not more deeply contion of a right, in the enjoyment of which the selves, your committee felt themselves constrained cerned. The true question in controversy, is of to decide, influenced by existing circumstances of a character too imperious to be resisted: these Iest of the whole nation: It is the right of exa very different character; it involves the interwill enumerate before I sit down. My business at present is to address a particular portion of the porting the productions of our own soil and inmembers of this House-I mean, sir, the Repub-dustry to foreign markets. Sir, our vessels are lican members and although what I am about France, and condemned by the British Courts of now captured when destined to the ports of to say might be deemed impolitic on ordinary Admiralty, without even the pretext of having subjects of legislation, yet, at this time and on on board contraband of war, enemies' property, this occasion, it would be criminal to conceal a single thought which might influence their de-or, having in any other respect violated the laws termination. We should now, Mr. Speaker, forget little party animosities, we should mingle minds freely, and, as far as we are able, commune with the understandings of each other; and, the decision once made, let us become one people,

of nations. These depredations on our lawful committed, are not to be traced to any maxims or merce, under whatever ostensible pretence comrules of public law, but to the maritime supretile and unjust policy of that country towards us, macy, and pride of the British nation. This hos

is not to be wondered at, when we recollect that the United States are already the second commercial nation in the world. The rapid growth of our commercial importance, has not only awakened the jealousy of the commercial interests of Great Britain, but her statesmen, no doubt, anticipate with deep concern, the maritime greatness of this Republic.

The unjust and unprecedented demands now made by Great Britain, that we shall cause the markets of the Continent to be opened to her manufactures, fully justifies the views I have suggested.

That we as a neutral nation should interfere between belligerents in their municipal regulations, will not be contended for by any one. From the course pursued by that nation for some years past, it evidently appears, that neither publie law nor justice, but power alone, is made by her the test of maritime rights.

H. OF R.

you, sir, who have often measured your strength with his in forensic debate, can attest that he in a good degree, was the pride of the Western country, and Kentucky claimed him as a favorite son. For his loss, with those who fell by his side, the whole Western country is ready to march; they only wait for our permission; and sir, war once declared, I pledge myself for my people-they will avenge the death of their brethren...

Another consideration drawn from our past conduct demands the course we have proposed. In the year 1808, Congress declared that this nation had but three alternatives left-war, embargo, or submission; since that time no advantageous change has taken place in our foreign relations; we now have no embargo, we have not declared war. I then say it, with humiliation, produced by the degradation of my country, we have submitted. Mr. Speaker, I derive no pleasure from speaking in this way of my country, but it is true, and, however painful the truth may be, it should be told.

What, Mr. Speaker, are we now called on to decide? It is, whether we will resist by force the attempt, made by that Government, to subject our maritime rights to the arbitrary and capricious rule of her will; for my part I am not prepared to say that this country shall submit to have her commerce interdicted or regulated, by any foreign nation. Sir, I prefer war to sub-repeal it. What effects is the operation of this

mission.

Over and above these unjust pretensions of the British Government, for many years past they have been in the practice of impressing our seamen, from merchant vessels; this unjust and lawless invasion of personal liberty, calls loudly for the interposition of this Government. To those better acquainted with the facts in relation to it, I leave it to fill up the picture. My mind is irresistibly drawn to the West.

Another reason operates on my mind; we stand pledged to the French nation to continue in force our non-importation law against Britain; without a violation of national faith we cannot

law producing? It is demoralizing our citizens; men of commercial habits cannot easily change their course of life; those who have lived in affluence and ease cannot consent to beg for bread. No, sir, they will violate this law, they will smuggle; and, sir, in politics, as in private life, if you wish men to remain virtuous, lead them not into temptation.

tremely. Ask the Northern man, and he will tell you that any state of things is better than the present; inquire of the Western people why their crops are not equal to what they were in former years, they will answer that industry has no stimulus left, since their surplus products have no markets. Notwithstanding these objections to the present restrictive system, we are bound to retain it-this, and our plighted faith to the French Government, have tied the gordian knot; we cannot untie it; we can cut it with the sword.

This restrictive system operates unequally; some parts of the Union enjoy the same advanAlthough others may not strongly feel the tages which they possessed when no difficulties bearing which the late transactions in that quar-attended our foreign relations; others suffer exter have on this subject, upon my mind they have great influence. It cannot be, believed by any man who will reflect, that the savage tribes, uninfluenced by other Powers, would think of making war on the United States. They understand too well their own weakness, and our strength. They have already felt the weight of our arms; they know they hold the very soil on which they live as tenants at sufferance. How, then, sir, are we to account for their late conduct? In one way only; some powerful nation must have intrigued with them, and turned their peaceful disposition towards us into hostilities. Great Britain alone has intercourse with those Northern tribes; I therefore infer, that if British gold has not been employed, their baubles and trinkets, and the promise of support and a place of refuge if necessary, have had their effect.

If I am right in this conjecture, war is not to commence by sea or land, it is already begun; and some of the richest blood of our country has already been shed. Yes, Mr. Speaker, in one individual has fallen, the honest man, the orator, and the soldier. That he loved his country none can doubt he died to preserve its honor and its fame-I mean the late commander of the cavalry; |

This war, if carried on successfully, will have its advantages. We shall drive the British from our Continent-they will no longer have an apportunity of intriguing with our Indian neighbors, and setting on the ruthless savage to tomahawk our women and children. That nation will lose her Canadian trade, and, by having no resting place in this country, her means of annoying us will be diminished. The idea I am now about to advance is at war, I know, with sentiments of the gentleman from Virginia: I am willing to receive the Canadians as adopted brethren; it will have beneficial political effects; it will preserve the equilibrium of the Government. When Louisiana shall be fully peopled, the Northern

DECEMBER, 1811.

Spanish American Colonies.

H. of R.

be so many objections, that it will require very strong considerations to recommend it.

Previous to the arrival of Mr. Skipwith with your you to decide according to the probable course of his despatches of September 10, our affairs with Spain had movements on the most expedient and expeditious mode undergone the particular consideration of the President, of holding the necessary communications with his cabiwith a reference as well to the change in the state of net. Rather than risk a delay which may lose a favorable things in Europe as to the approaching session of Con- crisis, it may be even advisable to repair to his military gress; and it had been determined-1. That the man-quarters. This is a step, however, to which there may ner in which the negotiations at Madrid had been closed by Spain forbade any application whatever to her for a renewal of them; 2. That the case should be presented to Congress, for such provisions as it might be thought to require on their part: 3. That, in the meantime, you should be charged to place before the French Government the necessity to which Spain, by refusing to concur in a diplomatic adjustment of her controversies with the United States, had reduced the latter, of seeking justice by those ulterior measures which the occa-sential to their interest, and to obtain East Florida, sion called for. It had also been determined by the President, with a view to enable the French Government, if it should be so disposed, to hasten by its mediating influence on Spain the change in her councils necessary to an amicable adjustment with the United States, and to bring Spain forward for the purpose, that you should be furnished with the terms which Spain might obtain from the United States.

As soon as any authority at Paris shall be ready on the part of Spain, you will enter on the subject, and press it to a conclusion with as much celerity and decision as circumstances will justify. The terms stated as your guide require little explanation more than accompanies the several articles. The object with the United States is to secure West Florida, which is eswhich is important to them, procuring, at the same time, equitable indemnities from Spain for the injuries for which she is answerable, to all which the proposed exchange of territory and arrangement of the western boundary may be made subservient. The desire manifested by the House of Representatives in the resolution herewith enclosed, that such an exchange and arrangement may be found sufficient, without any price On the receipt of your communications by Mr. Skip-in money, will engage all your attention and exertions. with, the ideas disclosed by the French Government were considered as forming a sufficient basis for an anticipating provision by Congress, such as was made in reference to the convention of the 30th of April, 1803, and it was accordingly determined, in pursuance of that example, to await the meeting of Congress, and lay the subject before them. This was done; and the act and resolutions, of which copies are enclosed, were the result of their discussions; a result which has been delayed by the forms of proceeding, and some variances of opinion on the occasion, longer than might have been wished.

I now enclose the outline and substance of a conventional arrangement adapted to the views expressed by Congress, and such as the President authorizes you to conclude. You will lose no time in imparting it to the French Government in the manner you may deem most expedient; letting it know, at the same time, that no direct communication on the subject has been made to the Spanish Government; that after the reception given by Spain to the overtures made through an extraordinary mission to Madrid, followed by her military and menacing indications within and near the controverted territories, as explained in the annexed extracts, the United States, though ready to meet Spain in negotiation under the auspices of a common friend, do not consider it belonging to them to court a further negotiation in any form; that, consequently, the steps necessary on the part of Spain must be the result either of her own reflections, or of the prudent council which France may undertake to give her.

The President leaves to your own management the expression of those sentiments, which, without any improper condescensions on the part of the United States, will best conciliate the French Government to our objects. The ascendency which it will have over that of Spain, if no change of circumstances intervene, and the preference of an amicable termination of our differences with Spain to an appeal to force, require that every honorable use should be made of the occasion which seems to offer itself.

Should the Emperor still be absent, without authority in any hands at Paris to take measures in concert with you for instituting the business, it must remain with

If the exchange stated in the resolution with the Sabine river for our western boundary below the ridge, dividing the waters running into the Mississippi from those running into the gulf westward of the mouth of that river can be obtained, the exchange will be satisfactory, especially if accompanied with a reasonable provision for the indemnities due from Spain to citizens of the United States. If the exchange can be obtained even without this last provision, or including the territory eastward of the Perdido, or any pecuniary payment for the territory westward thereof, it is not to be rejected; but in that case it will be extremely desirable to make the authorized establishment of an interval of territory, not to be settled for a given period, subservient to a provision for indemnities.

In order to determine the price and the payments to Spain for the cession of territory, and to provide indemnities for the spoliations and other injuries for which Spain is responsible, you will add to the preceding articles others proper on those subjects. For the several modifications which will best comport with the conve nience of our Treasury, and the sentiments of the Secretary of that Department, I refer to copies of a letter and paper from him, herewith enclosed, stating to you generally for your guide-1. That the sum to be made payable to Spain for her cession is not to exceed five millions of dollars; 2. That as little as possible, and in no event more than two millions, are to be paid prior to the delivery of possession or the ratification; 3. That as ample a provision as possible be made for indemnities, either by constituting a board of commissioners for settling them, or by a sum in gross, sufficient to cover their probable amount, which is not less than four millions of dollars, and distributable by the United States to such claimants, and in such proportions, as may be decided upon under their authority. This last mode of providing for the object will be much the best, if the sum in gross be equal to the amount of claims likely to be allowed by a Board of Commissioners; 4. It is particularly desirable that, in defining the cases to be indemnified, the terms should be such as will embrace those where French subjects or citizens, as well as those where Spanish subjects were the wrong doers. If a sum in gross be stipulated, it may be expected that