far it is maintained and supported by the slave traffic, which for 200 years, the natives of Europe, have carried on with the natives of the coast, it is not in my power to explain. If my sentiments should be required concerning the effect which a discontinuance of that commerce would produce on the manners of the natives, I should have no hesitation in say ing, that in the present unenlightened state of their minds, the effect would neither be so extensive nor beneficial, as many worthy persons fondly expect." Having left the African coast, I now come, my lords, to the Middle Passage. I am, and always shall be, a sincere friend to wise and humane regulations in transporting the negroes from Africa to the West Indies. The noble earl (Liverpool), in the year 1788, brought in the first Carrying bill; a very wise and useful measure. Let foreign nations make no regulations for their own vessels, and import into their own islands, disease and discontent amongst the slaves brought from the coast of Africa; we, thank God, are actuated by other considerations than mere gain. We are actuated by principles of humanity. Out of 15,508 negroes, shipped in 1796, 559 died, being about 34 per cent. According to the new Carrying bill, the above 15,508 negroes will be reduced to 10,252, which is a reduction of one third. Your lordships will therefore perceive, that every attention has not only been paid to the health of the slaves, but by the experience of eleven years, that object has been completely established. Having now brought your lordships to the West Indies, I trust I may be allowed for a moment to pause, and consider a little who are the West India proprietors: They are our fellow-subjects; they are Englishmen; they are, if not born, at least educated in this country. From local knowledge, and personal experience, I must bear testimony to the affection and to the loyalty they entertain for their king and the mother country. It has been frequently mentioned, whenever this question has been agitated in this House: the riches and flourishing state of the West Indies. I admit it, and rejoice at the fact; and may, therefore, fairly assert, that in a free country, where, thank God, every thing is to be attained by individuals, it cannot be supposed that a West India proprietor pays less attention to the education of his child than any other Briተ tish subject; and indeed, your lordships know, that the great schools of Eton, Westminster, Harrow, and Winchester, are full of the sons of the West Indians. It would be a reflection indeed, which the right reverend and learned prelates I am sure would contradict, to say, that young men quitting these great public schools, to complete their educations at the seminaries of Oxford and Cambridge, and the universities of Scotland and Ireland, should turn out disgraceful to human nature, and destitute of heart and common feeling. Facts, my lords, speak for themselves: Since the commencement of the French war, three events have arisen in the British West India islands. The first, the Maroon war, in the island of Jamaica. A tribe of Coromantine negroes (part of the Maroons), in amity with the British nation, unjustly made war upon the inhabitants of Jamaica. From the British officers employed in that war, I understand these Maroons, notwithstanding constant intercourse of more than a century with christians, to be totally void of all religion whatsoever; to be completely savage and barbarous, and to go entirely naked, with the exception of short trowsers. Neither have they, though surrounded by the British plantations, shown any degree of cultivation excepting by the provisions which they grow for their own use. During this Maroon war, the slaves on the island of Jamaica remained quiet, peaceable, loyal, and affectionate. The war was soon concluded, and the slaves had the warmest approbation of their masters.-In the island of St. Vincent the second event took place, namely, the Carib war. The Caribs are the aborigines of the country, and were permitted to remain in quiet possession upon the mountains of that island. It was not till the peace of 1763, that St. Vincent was entirely ceded to the king of Great Britain; and the Caribs, previous to this cession to England, having had communication with the French, maintained it during the whole of the peace. The island was consequently captured last war with the assistance of the Caribs; and this war, at the instigation of the French, the Caribs began a new rupture with the British inhabitants of St. Vincent's. Hostilities were fortunately concluded, and the Caribs, since that time, have been removed off the island. During this war, the slaves upon the different estates have remained steady and quiet, and still continue loyal and dutiful to their masters.— The third and last event was, I confess an | most cases, diminish, there is consequently insurrection of slaves in the island of Gre- a very great inconvenience. In case the nada; but, my lords, it was an insurrec-abolition should unfortunately take place, tion of French slaves belonging to French the English planter, more active and more masters, tainted with French principles; fertile at expedients of commerce than for even at that time the slaves belonging any other, would inevitably, upon those to the British never joined in the revolt, estates that increase in negro population, but remained quiet upon the plantations turn slave-breeder, and then supply difof their owners. I trust that these three ferent states and different islands. The material circumstancess will bear me out consequences that have been so often in my assertion respecting the general drawn (the tearing of the slave from his good treatment of the British planters to country and family), would indeed, in their slaves in the West Indies. I may this case, take effect, for the civilized and also with truth affirm, that the treatment domiciliated slave would be torn from his of the negro slaves in the British islands, family and connexions, to supply the deis far superior to that of all foreign na- ficiencies on those estates and islands tions. where the negro population does not increase. All European nations are anxious to wrest this valuable trade out of our hands. I shall not advance as an argument that the French have abolished the trade, because they have at this time no settlements in the West Indies. That is a specious but a weak position. I have every reason In the session of 1707, the House of Commons, presented an address to his majesty, and a circular letter was sent out to the different governors in the British West Indies, to recommend colonial regulations, and to pass different acts of the legislature for the amelioration of slaves. It is with real pleasure I can observe, that the British planters in the different to believe, that the motive for the removal islands have given the most satisfactory answers upon that subject. All the islands indeed have taken some steps, except the island of Dominica, where the assembly happened to be dissolved. And it is but justice to the proprietors of the British West India islands to observe, that all that has been gained upon the subject of the amelioration of the state of the negro is, that that is now made law which before was a universal and established custom. In 1787, the island of Jamaica was in extreme distress for provisions, and the assembly presented an address to the then governor, to induce him to allow supplies to be imported in American vessels. They therein state, that between 1780 and 1787, from the dreadful effects of hurricanes, the negro population was 15,000 short of what it was in 1780. It is true, that upon some estates, the negro population may and does increase; and it is equally clear, that upon many others it rapidly diminishes consequently the planters are obliged to purchase slaves annually. In the island of Jamaica, a particular friend of mine has two adjoining estates, both in Montego bay. On the one the negroes increase; and on the other, though adjacent, they are obliged, by the decrease of population, to make annual purchases. Some estates in St. Vincent's increase, whilst in Tobago there is little probability of an increase; and as the latter, in of Victor Hugues from Gaudaloupe, by the French Directory, was for the express purpose of re-establishing the slave trade in that island, which, since the passing of the abolition, had been found very beneficial in a state point of view. The new opinions adopted in France, productive of anarchy and confusion, were certainly consonant to the sudden impulse for the abolition. By the circumstances stated, respecting Gaudaloupe, it is evident, that there is a considerable change of opinion on this subject in France: and that opi. nion has been strongly corroborated by a reference to the policy of the Portuguese, who carry on that trade with great advantage and profit. Much stress has been laid upon the abolition of the trade by the Danes. But I now hold in my hand a bill received this day, drawn upon the Danish consul in this country, in payment for slaves bought so late as the 12th of February last; and it is equally well ascertained, that the Danish factors have, within these last twelve months, returned to the coast of Africa. Some enthusiasts have endeavoured to maintain, that America has abandoned the slave trade; but it is a fact upon record, that the Americans are now carrying it on for the Spaniards; and, notwithstanding an act of abolition has passed the congress, the government of that country is not sufficiently strong to enforce its own laws on this particular subject. This spirit of resistance to the American legislature is not a little heightened by the many advantages obtained under the sanction of the Spanish govern ment. I come now, my lords to the last, though not the least part of the subject namely the importance of the West Indies. In 1788, the British West India capital amounted to seventy millions sterJing; employing 689 vessels, 148,176 tons, navigated by 14,000 seamen. The gross duties to the British empire, 1,800,000. In 1796, the trade required 350,230 tons, navigated by 24,000 seamen. If the value of the conquests from the French Spaniards, and Dutch, amounting to at least 20,000,000l. be added, I may safely assert, that the present British capital in the West Indies, is equal to 100 millions sterling. A sum which demands your most serious consideration, before you consent to the abolition of that trade without which it could not exist. When I say, that, on the proof of this interesting fact I repose the whole strength of my argument, I am confident that your lordships will pause, and fully weigh the consequences of your vote this evening. I am confident that, as the hereditary guardians of British subjects, you will stretch out your hands to protect, not to destroy: I am confident that, as hereditary counsellors of the crown, you will give life and spirit, instead of dejection and death, to a most loyal description of his majesty's subjects. Lord Grenville observed, that on what had fallen from the illustrious duke he did not mean to comment: between him and that royal personage there could be no personal debate, because between them there was no equality- Lord Romney called to order. He agreed with the noble secretary of state, that personally there was no equality between an illustrious prince and any other member of that House: there could be no equality: personal equality between his royal highness and any other member then in the House, there was none; but he always understood that his majesty, having called any person to a seat in that House, gave him an equality with any other personage in it, as to the right of speaking. Lord Grenville said he was far from taking it unkind, that his noble relation had spoken to order. He was clearly convinced, however, that he had infringed [VOL. XXXIV.] upon no rule of order. He questioned no right of speech in that House: he only said, that between his royal highness and himself, there could be no debate personally, because there was no equality. Lord Thurlow said :-I wish to have it clearly understood, whether it is the constitution of this House, that we are unequal in our right to speak here. I am one of the lowest in point of rank. I contend not for superiority of talent, or for any preference whatever; but I claim to be exactly equal, not only to the illustrious personage who has just spoken, but also with the prince of Wales, if he were present in this House, and acting as a peer of parliament. I know of no difference between peers of parliament, considered in their parliamentary character, and I do think that the lowest in rank in the House is equal to the highest, while we are debating. If rank or talents created an inequality in our right to speak in this House, the illustrious personage who has just spoken would have a higher right than I pretend to have; but I do claim for my humble self, an equality with every prince of the blood, or any other who has a seat in this House to speak my sentiments. Lord Grenville observed, that he was not convinced by what had fallen from either of the two noble lords, and therefore he would proceed to discuss the question on its own merits simply. The first thing which the House had to consider was, the nature of the present bill. Before he came to that point, he would declare generally, that no advantage which individuals, or the public, could derive from the continuance of the slave trade between the coast of Africa and the West Indies, should ever induce him to give it his approbation, or to consider it in any other light than a system of fraud, robbery, and murder. But detestable as that system was, it was not the object of this bill to do it away; it was to prevent its continuance in a particular spot, where it was carried on under circumstances of aggravation tenfold greater than in any other place. The quantity of district from which the bill went to prohibit the trade, was about one-fourth of the whole of the coast on which the trade was carried on. It could not therefore be contended, that the trade would be so far injured as to stop those supplies which the colonies were said to stand in need of; but still less could such a proposition be maintained, after it had appeared in evidence at their [4 B] lordships' bar, that the number of slaves annually exported from this district amounted to little more than 3,000, making only one-twentieth part of all the slaves carried away from the coast of Africa during the course of a year in British ships. It was extremely important for their lordships to consider what was the cause of this comparatively small number. It was proved from the evidence, that it was owing to the depopulation of the country, in consequence of the numbers of slaves that had been carried away from this coast, because it lay nearer to the West Indies than the other coasts. If any noble lord doubted this depopulation, let him but recollect that part of the evidence which stated, that the ships which stopped to take up slaves at this coast spent some months longer in completing their voyage than the vessels that went farther off; and that this was caused by their being obliged to wait so long a time before they could complete their cargoes.-Now with regard to the injury which it was said the colonies would sustain from stopping the trade on this district, he would again call their lordships attention to the evidence, which stated, that not one of the 3,000 slaves annually exported from this coast, were carried to any of our West India possessions which were the property of West India merchants; but that they were for several years sold at Demarara, and some places on the coast of America. Therefore if the House should pass the present bill, the people in the West Indies would not know, except by report, that such a law existed. It was evident, therefore, that the restriction from trading on this coast could neither injure our colonies, nor materially affect the persons immediately concerned in the trade. But there were other parties whose interests deserved to be consulted as much as those concerned in the slave trade. This was the Sierra Leone company; a company which originated from the purest principles of philanthropy, and which was highly deserving of praise and encouragement. One of the counsel who had lately appeared at the bar against this bill, spoke in a sneering manner of this company, and of the feeble attempts it had made in producing any articles of trade. But he would ask noble lords, whether any of those colonies, which were now rich and flourishing states in America, had in the space of fifty years after their first establishment, made a greater progress than the Sierra Leone company had done in the space of seven years? Was it nothing that this company had imported ivory into Great Britain, and were likely to carry that trade to a considerable extent? Was it nothing that they had discovered a dye which could colour a much finer blue than indigo? Was it nothing that the company had cultivated cotton, whieh promised to be very productive? But, upon this part of the subject, it had been argued by counsel, that this cultivation of cotton would injure the planters in the West Indies. If any noble lord suffered such an argument to weigh with him for a moment, he would inform him, that such was, at this moment, the scarcity of cotton, that manufacturers could not carry on their business for want of it. In short, the Sierra Leone company had made efforts that promised hereafter to be of the most essential benefit to this country. There was no part of the globe on which it was not possible to produce things useful for man. Africa, which was hitherto regarded only for the purpose of being pillaged and desolated, possessed all these natural advantages in common with other parts of the world. All that was now required of the House was, that it would sanction a measure which had for its object, not only the improvement of such advantages under the care of this highly valuable body of men he was speaking of, but also to rescue from the most dreadful calamities a country that had long been a prey to rapine and cruelty. Was this country capable of being improved? It was. And the negroes were capable of civilization. Let any noble lord, who wished to satisfy himself on the subject, read the account of Mr. Park's travels, and there he would find, that those people who lived in the interior of the country were in a state of civilization; that they cultivated land, and that they were capable of practising all the social virtues, and all those acts of hospitality and kindness which would do honour to the most polished societies. Very different, however, was the situation of the countries bordering on the coasts. All history proved, that wherever a trade was carried on in slaves, that country must be in a state of barbarism. In the first or second page of Thucydides, it would be found that at one time all the states of Greece which bordered on the sea, were in an uncivilized and savage state, because in those places a trade had been carried on in slaves; and such was also the case with our own island at the time the Romans invaded it. In like manner, the country which was now the object of discussion, was in the most dreadful state, in consequence of this nefarious and bloody traffic; in the course of which captains of ships had fraudulently swept away whole families. Some of these captains had lately appeared at the bar as witnesses the first instance he had seen of persons swearing on a question in which they were interested. Four of them swore that it was absolutely necessary for ships trading to the Leeward coast to stop at the prohibited district for provisions, and that they had stopt there. By his directions their log-books were brought forward on the following day, when it appeared that they had not stopped on this coast; and that, so far from its being necessary to stop, not above one or two ships out of 100 had stopped there. He would not express what he felt on this occasion; but if their lordships, at the time these men gave their evidence, had been sitting in a judicial instead of a legislative capacity, he was confident they would have adopted a proceeding different from what they had done. He would mention another fact, to show the peculiar cruelty of trading to this coast: on account of the length of time that elapsed before the ships completed their cargoes of slaves, a mortality to an extraordinary extent always took place amongst these unhappy wretches, whose fate he would call by no other name than that of murder. Such were the deplorable scenes which this country exhibited this country, whose bleeding wounds the present bill proposed to heal. No consideration of interest should induce that House for a moment to delay this act of justice, if the argument of interest could be urged with any truth; but it could not; for it had been proved, that the trade whose abolition was sought for, was productive of very little interest, but of great calamity. The Earl of Westmorland said :-After all the abuse and the clamour which, both in and out of parliament, have been thrown upon the slave trade, with great embarrassment, I should offer myself to your lordships to oppose this measure, if I did not feel that there was a duty superior to such considerations-a duty to protect the rights, the property, the interests of the subjects of England, the commerce of the merchants, the property of the planters of the West-Indies, whilst at the same time, I feel that I am neither deserting the cause of humanity nor the cause of the natives of Africa.-It has been the practice upon this occasion to endeavour to work upon your lordships passions, by animated descriptions of the miseries of the slave trade and slavery, paying no great respect to your lordships by insinuating that such pictures were necessary to rouse your feelings. But, in my judgment, the time would have been better spent if it had been employed in showing in what manner the bill before us would tend to remedy any one of the enormities complained of. After, however, all the abuse which has been poured upon this subject, I trust I shall not give offence, if, in wiping the blood and dirt from my own face, I should happen to scatter it a little around me; and if this celebrated Sierre Leone company, these amis des noirs, these dealers in ivory and benevolence, at the expense of the blood and treasure of other men, shall feel a little the effect of the rebound, and shall not appear in that light, either of humanity or disinterestedness, in which they would wish to describe themselves. It is, my lords, a peculiar satisfaction to me to see an attendance of the reverend bench, the respect and dignity of whose characters must always give consideration and weight; and I rely upon having their support in resisting a measure which I shall show to be only, under specious pretences, an organization of bloodshed, and a bounty upon enor➡ mities. This bill is to limit the trading in slaves from a certain part of the Coast of Africa, for the purpose of supporting the Sierra Leone company, and introducing civilization and English manufactures; but it has, in truth, no such object, nor do its provisions at all tend to that point. It is only under certain specious pretences, to induce your lordships to adopt the principle of abolition, with a view to lead to the abolition of the slave trade, and, as a certain corollary, the abolition of the negro-slavery in the West-Indies. About ten years ago the House of Commons sent up to your lordships certain resolutions for the abolition of the slave trade. Your lordships, with that humanity which has distinguished you upon all occasions, passed regulations for the conduct of that trade. But the question of abolition struck your lordships as of serious im |