The radical objections are three ; | paid; and if the spirit of economy is once namely, that the measure in question will introduced into the establishments of pripromote emigration, will diminish the pro- vate families, which, I think, is likely to duce of the old taxes, and will raise the be the result of so violent a measure, that price of all the necessaries of life. There cold economy may continue; in which is no circumstance so likely to be appre- case we shall lose a permanent for a hended from this measure, as the emigra- temporary advantage; and those taxes, tion of the industrious classes of the com- on the produce of which depend the paymunity. If, in addition to all the usual ment of our public creditors, and the subtaxes to which the people of the country sistence of our fleets and armies, may beare subjected, and which are in general come inadequate to the purpose. This is reckoned tolerably oppressive, persons are a point, in which many persons who now also made liable to a compulsive disclosure hear me, are deeply interested, who are of property, which has ever been accounted thinking little at present how much they so odious and vexatious a measure, and are personally concerned in these discusalso to have that property severely taxed, sions.-A third radical objection is, the it must induce great multitudes of indivi- effect that this tax will have, in raising duals to desert a country, where they are the price of all the necessaries of life; subjected to such grievous oppression, insomuch, that the middling and lower and to find out some quiet asylum, where orders of the community will find it diffithey may escape such rapacity. If such cult to subsist under it. Several articles a circumstance were to take place, and it of general consumption, as salt, sugar, is evidently not impossible, nor, in my coals, &c. are already exorbitantly high, opinion improbable, it would be the and must become still more so. Indeed source of infinite mischief to this country. if we severely tax those who raise or proIf the ingenious mechanic, the industrious duce the necessaries of life, and those artisan, the adventurous manufacturer, the who deal in them, it is evident, that they hardy seaman, the intelligent merchant, will endeavour to throw the load off their and the skilful husbandman, oppressed own shoulders, and will contrive to make by financial exactions, are driven from the unfortunate consumer pay tenfold, for this formerly happy island, what will be- the taxes to which they themselves are come of the boastful power and opulence subjected. of the British nation? Some are already gone, and others are, perhaps, preparing to follow their footsteps. The passing of such a law as this, must confirm any resolution they have taken, and may banish for ever from this country, some of the most valuable subjects it can at present boast of. Another material objection is, that it will occasion a very fatal reduction in the produce of the old taxes. Many luxurious gratifications, which furnish an ample revenue to the exchequer, must be curtailed or abandoned. Many people are already considering, whether they ought, or ought not, to replenish their pipes and snuff boxes, on which depends a branch of revenue (that on tobacco), yielding to the amount of 700,000l. per annum. Other articles must suffer in proportion. If the national income, as stated by the right hon. gentleman, is 100 millions, we pay about 30 millions of that sum to the exchequer at present: for which some allowance ought to have been made in his statements; and if we are reduced to the private expenditure of 60 instead of 70 millions, there must be a considerable defalcation from the 30 millions formerly [VOL. XXXIV.]

I shall now proceed to state some objections of a less important nature, because they are capable of being removed; but which, at the same time, unless they can be obviated, ought to prove fatal to the measure. The first point I shall touch upon, under this head, relates to the taxing of the funds, which must alarm every one, attached to the old financial system and doctrines of this country, in opposi tion to the new political dogmas, which, in these days, are so boldly inculcated. By the laws, as they now stand, the interests or dividends paid to the public creditors, are protected against all charges and taxes whatsoever; but, for the first time, they are now introduced into the budget of the chancellor of the exchequer. It is said, that there is no direct tax upon the funds; that we do not intercept the money, as it goes into the pocket of the creditor'; but that we only put our hands into his pocket afterwards, and inform him, whether he consents or not, he must, at his peril (the words of the precept of the commissioners are, "thereof fail not at your peril") deliver over to us, a tenth part of that sum of money, which [G]

heavy a burthen upon persons residing here, with their property elsewhere, must be, not only to drive them out of this country, but also to prevent others from coming into it; in which case we shall not only lose the proposed exaction, but also the taxes which they pay in various other ways; and also, all the advantages we derive from the circulation of from five to six millions per annum.

we assured him, when he lent the principal, was to be exempted from all taxes and charges whatsoever. What a miserable evasion! Indeed, if this principle of indirect, and involuntary taxation is once admitted in regard to the funds, there is no saying to what height it may be carried. What is the remedy? The remedy is an easy one, and has been practised on all occasions, when the principle or the interest of the public creditor has been The only other point I wish to touch affected, let books be opened for receiving upon at present, relates to the new inquithe names of all the creditors who assent sitorial power about to be established. to this new mode of holding their pro- That some regulations are necessary, in perty, and let it go no farther than to the order to prevent evasion, can hardly be persons who subscribe. I trust that a questioned; but that they should be so very large majority of the creditors, if not very strict, or rather so boldly tyrannical, the whole of them, would agree to the as those which are pointed out in this bill, proposal, and voluntarily subject them-seems to me completely inadmissible. To selves to the new tax. At any rate, no consideration whatever ought, in my opinion, to induce this House to countenance any paltry evasion, by which its solemn faith, pledged to the public creditors, can, to the smallest possible extent, be violated.

tempt a man to perjury, and to subject him, at the same time, to an inquisitorial power, in order to make him condemn himself, is the height of cruelty and injustice. For my part, I think it infinitely preferable that we should lose some money, than run the risk of establishing principles abhorrent to that free constitution which this country has hitherto boasted of. This is a part of the subject, however, which will require to be discussed with peculiar anxiety in a future stage of our proceedings.

No

The next point I wish to allude to, can also be remedied in the committee on the bill. It relates to the idea of taxing persons residing in this country, for the property which they possess in other parts of his majesty's dominions; for instance, in Ireland and the West Indies. This seems to me unjust in its principle; and, so far But, Sir, it may be said, that this is as my information reaches, without ex- certainly a harsh measure, and liable to ample in the financial history of this, or endless objections; at the same time, any other country. Both in Ireland and what can be done? Some great measure in the West Indies, there are separate of finance is now essential for the public legislatures, who enjoy the privilege of safety; and if you oppose this measure, imposing taxes on the property of those you ought to suggest something else that who are subject to their respective juris- may answer in its room. I cannot posdiction;-a privilege which they exercise sibly subscribe to that doctrine. to a considerable extent. Taxing pro- member is bound to do more, than to deperty in other places, by the authority of liver his sentiments on public measures, the British parliament, is reviving the old as they are respectively brought forand exploded doctrines, which laid the ward. No private individual can have acfoundation of the unfortunate war with cess to that minute information, without America. But, Sir, I doubt, first, the which it is impossible to judge whether right, and, secondly, the policy of this a measure can be prejudicial to the pubmeasure. In regard to the right, taxes lic interest or otherwise. But if there is are described to be "a portion which any doubt regarding the best mode of each subject contributes of his property, raising the supplies, let a select committee in order to secure the remainder." If this of the House be appointed for the invesdefinition is a just one, and it is judge tigation of that subject, armed with auBlackstone's, we have no right to take thority to send for persons, papers, and the produce of the property of Ireland, records. The House and the public may except to defend Ireland; nor the pro- be assured, if a proper select committee duce of the property of Jamaica, except were appointed, that all the financial diffito defend Jamaica. In regard to the im-culties we are involved in would be repolicy of the attempt, it is, if possible, moved; and surely, since we had out-ofstill clearer. The effect of imposing so door committees, gravely deliberating on

the best mode of levying taxes, and who have favoured us with their public declarations on the subject of finance, there can hardly be any well-grounded objection to the measure I have suggested; and I hope, from the gestures of the right hon. gentleman (Mr. Pitt), that he approves of, and will support the idea.

It will naturally be expected, that on such an occasion, I should again take the liberty of recommending to the attention of the House, that most valuable of all resources, I mean economy. We are told by a celebrated statesman of antiquity, whose orations the right hon. gentleman has so frequently perused, and so closely imitates, I mean Cicero, "optimum, et in privatis familiis, et in republica, vectigal est, parsimonium:" and I am perfectly satisfied, there would be no difficulty, instead either of borrowing the sum in question, or raising it by means of an extraordinary and harsh contribution, to save a large proportion of it, by a rigorous spirit of retrenchment in all our establishments, both of income and expenditure.

borrowing, and, at 5 per cent, would pay the interest of 200 millions of money. What a temptation to continue the war, when, perhaps, peace might be obtained on reasonable terms, and to carry it on with the most unbounded extravagance and profusion? Besides, Sir, is it possible to imagine, if this tax is once imposed, that we shall ever get rid of it? Whilst the war continues, it is certain we cannot; and if peace were to be proclaimed tomorrow, it is, at least, questionable, whether such an addition to the public revenue, would not be necessary, from the enormous peace establishment, which the circumstances of the times may occasion, at least in the opinion of those with whom cold economy is no particular favourite. And indeed, if it should not be found necessary on account of our peace establishment, such an addition to the public revenue, will be extremely convenient to assist in discharging the national debt as a commutation for other taxes, or on some such similar pretence.-It is farther necessary to observe, that this bill lays a foundation for endless vexatious exactions. The minister now very moderately requires only a tenth part of our income; but he establishes a principle, that the government of this country is entitled to demand a certain part of the income of each individual, and is also entitled to enforce that compulsive requisition, by the strictest and harshest regulations. Formerly, Sir, our principal taxes, arising from consumption, and not extending to many of the real comforts and necessaries of life, were in a manner voluntary. The exchequer was enriched, and the people were happy; and the profusion of government was fortunately checked by the conviction, that, if the taxes were carried beyond a certain length, the produce, instead of increasing, would diminish. But, Sir, if this bill passes, the whole property of the country will in future lie at the mercy of the minister; and though he now proposes to exact but a tenth part, what is to hinder him, next year, from demanding a fifth, or even a third of our respective incomes?-Allow me to ask, how long it can be expected, that either the wealth or the industry of the people can hold out, under even the apprehension and terror of such exactions?

Indeed, in my opinion, nothing could raise more the character of the nation abroad, or give more satisfaction to the people at home, than our enforcing a system of economy. It is well known, that in private life that individual is alone independent and respectable, who, without being too parsimonious, is yet attentive to his expenditure. The same is the case with nations. In regard to the people at home, the minister may suppose, as they have submitted quietly to so many burthens, that they will continue patient under more: he may find himself mistaken. By a profuse expenditure of the public money he may secure the cry of those who are preying on the vitals of the public, and, perhaps, for the moment, the assistance of corrupt and profligate men; but he will soon lose, what every wise minister would prize above all other acquisitions, the satisfaction of his own mind, the confidence of a generous sovereign, and the support of a great country. I shall now, Sir, state some additional considerations to the House, which seem to me decisively hostile to the measure in question. The first is, the great tendency that the passing of such a bill will have, towards perpetuating the war, and promoting public profusion. As soon as it Such, Sir, are the objections which is ascertained, that ten millions of addi- have occurred to me against this fatal tional revenue can be raised upon the pub-measure: one, to which the attention of lic, it will be considered as a fund for the House, and of the public at large,

cannot be too earnestly and anxiously directed. The only answer likely to be given to these ojections, and, indeed, the only arguments that can be urged in support of the measure itself, are those philippics against the French Directory, with which the right hon. gentleman and his friends are accustomed to interlard their orations, and by which they endeavour to inflame the passions, and to perplex the understandings of a partial auditory. Permit me, however, to take the liberty of asking, what have such declamations to do with the present question? I detest the ambitious projects of the French Directory as much as that right hon. gentleman or his friends, and will go as great lengths to resist them. But because the French Directory are ambitious, must the people of England be oppressed, and must we, on that account, give way, and submit, even without a struggle, to such a mischievous project as the one now under consideration; a project, Sir, which could only have been occasioned by the most unbounded profusion, could only have originated in the harshest tyrannical principles, and must either terminate in the disgrace and ruin of the bold projector, or the destruction of the nation?

miration and respect, both in this country and on the continent of Europe; but that it will be accounted a degraded chamber of commerce and finance, calculated solely for the purpose of registering the edicts of a minister, without knowledge of their contents, or conviction of their utility.

Mr. Simeon said, that the single ques tion, in the first place, was, whether or not, considering all circumstances, it was wise to raise a large sum of money within the year?-upon which he believed there was but one opinion. The next point would be, whether it was wise to continue the assessed taxes, or adopt the present measure. He had opposed the assessed taxes last year, because he thought the plan would not answer; but he was glad the measure had been tried, because it had had the effect of ripening the public mind for the measure now before the House. He could not agree with the hon. baronet, with regard to a tax upon capital in real estate; because he thought it would be impossible to ascertain its value, or the value of the interest which each individual who enjoyed it had in that estate. The same objection would apply to some Other species of capital. As to capital in the funds, the idea of taxing it was unjust I have thus, Sir, stated at some length, in the highest degree, inasmuch as it might but not longer than the importance of the be the ruin of the holder, by compelling question demands, my sentiments regard him to sell out to an immense disadvaning it; and I earnestly entreat, that mem- tage. The case was quite different upon bers, divesting themselves of partiality for income. He then proceeded to take noone individual, and of prejudice against tice of the hints that had been thrown out others, will consider the subject itself dis- upon a former occasion, relative to the passionately, as one on which depends the taking the property to be found in corpofuture happiness of this country. Let ration and church lands, for the use of the them resolve, instead of taking a measure state. He hoped that would never be deof this moment blindly upon trust, be- liberately proposed in that House. Corcause it happens to be introduced by a porations were extremely useful for the favourite minister, let them resolve, on purpose of administering local justice. As the present occasion, to see with their to the church lands, he warned the own eyes, to hear with their own ears, House of the effect of such a measure in and to be directed by their own judg- another country. The clergy were the ment. Let them be assured, if they suf- great prop of the state, by the influence fer this bill to pass, that it will be an they had upon the morals of the people; event, which they themselves will severely when that prop was taken away, the buildrepent of when it will unfortunately be ing must fall. Gentlemen said that this too late, and which their posterity will measure was hard. What was the hardhave just cause to lament, as one of the ship? It was not in the tax; it was in greatest calamities that could possibly the cause of the tax. That cause was the have befallen that country they were war; and hardship was to be judged of doomed to inherit. Let them also be as- by comparison. Would we change consured, if such a bill as this meets with dition with any other part of Europe? their approbation, that the British House He knew of no better way of discussing of Commons will no longer be considered the policy of this measure, than by lookas that respectable senate, whose conducting at the effect it was likely to have on has formerly been looked up to, with ad- the price of the articles of life. Would

they rise in proportion to the sum raised; to monstrous inconveniences. In some which must be the case when a loan was cases, speculation was not only indulged, made? By no means; for as it affected but constituted part of the wealth, or every individual alike, there was no rather was the mean whereby a man prochance of charging more upon any cured wealth in certain situations in comarticle of trade now than formerly. As merce. He thought that this measure to the probability of emigration he had would affect a number of persons in this not any of the apprehensions of the respect. For instance, if a merchant hon. baronet. This plan affected no man paid 10 per cent on 10,000l. and it apwhose income was under 60l. a year; peared that he lived in a very splendid style, and therefore it was not likely to affect the he owned he should not like a bill of such price of labour. A man whose income a man for a large sum of money, because was 2001. in this country, whether by he knew that 10,000l. a year would not trade or otherwise, was not very likely support very great splendor, and the to emigrate. Where would they go to? merchant would have no means of conWould they go to France? or would they cealing this. Again, to take the case of cross the Atlantic? He professed him- a private gentleman, was the House self an enemy to all declamation upon unacquainted with the case of some this subject. Mischief might be produced gentlemen of property, who, in the by calling this an inquisitorial measure. early part of their lives, had been impruMany honest people, for want of being dent, and had brought incumbrances upon better informed, associated ideas to words their estates; would such persons like, very different from the meaning of gentle- that these things should be disclosed? men who used them in that House. Thus, And yet such must be the case under for instance, when the word inquisition the provisions of this bill. Many indiwas uttered, a great part of the public viduals might have expectations from rich annexed to it the idea of racks and tor-relations, which expectations would be all tures. So again, when a surveyor was called a spy, the public annexed mean and dishonest ideas to that office. Our enemies had made this measure necessary, for their object was avowedly the destruction of this country.

disappointed, when the cautious person came to see the imprudence of the object of his intended bounty.-He knew how the case stood already with regard to those who were employed by government to examine into people's fortunes; they were Mr. M. A. Taylor said, that if the employed to look how far people were acchancellor of the exchequer could satisfy curate in the payment of their taxes, and him that this measure would be attended whether they were fairly assessed, or not. with none of the inconveniences he was These persons went round at random, going to state, he would certainly give and surcharged, without caring what him his vote; for he had no fixed they do. The mischief of this was in hatred against the right hon. gentleman, nor many cases monstrous. For instance, he had he any pistol in his pocket to shoot himself lived 160 miles from London; the minister-a fate that was said to have suppose, while he was in the country, he befallen another great man, lately in ano- was unfairly surcharged in London; he ther part of the world, for attempting to should have no remedy, but by appeal beraise a contribution among the people, fore the commissioners in London; the The first objection he had to urge against expense of his coming to town to obtain this measure was, that it would cause a redress, would amount to more than the general disclosure of property. It was sum he was overcharged, and thus he indeed said, that the state of each indivi- must submit to be cheated, for he had dual's property should be kept a secret; no adequate remedy for the evil.but how was this secrecy to be kept up? Another objection he had to this measure Did not every man give his answer to the wàs of a constitutional nature. The getax-gatherer at the door? Any person in nius of the constitution of England was, the village in which a man lived might that a man's property was sacred. It know the state of his property. How was was upon the strength of that principle this money collected? By the common that every man's house was called his castax-collector. Was it not childish to say tle, and that the excise laws had always that any secrecy could accompany such a been held so odious in England. If exproceeding? This appeared to him to be cise laws were odious what was to be a measure that would subject merchants thought of the present bill? An excise§