prefented last year; he objected to it on account of the delay it occafioned. There was already one Petition which was ordered to be heard on the fecond reading, and the City of London had waved that permiffion. Sir W. Anderfon obferved, that this Petition was different from the former one-that was against the principle of the Bill, and this was against particular Claufes. It was not the intent of the City of London to throw any unneceffary delay in the way of the measure. Sir W. Geary prefented a Petition from several perfons whose names were thereto subscribed, praying for leave to bring in a Bill to make a Tunnel under the Thames, from Tilbury Fort to Gravefend. The Petition ftated, that there was an Horfe-ferry from Tilbury Fort to Gravefend, but that from the roughness of the water it was frequently impaffable-that the nearest Bridge was London, and that under fuch circumftances it was neceffary to make a circuit of 50 miles to gain the oppofite fhore-that it would be impoffible to build a Bridge, as it would impede the paffage of fhips navigating the river; and that they had taken the opinion of an able Engineer, who had stated, that a Tunnel could easily be made under the river, it being not above goo yards broad, by which both horfes and carriages might at all times pafs with fecurity and eafe; they, therefore, prayed for leave to bring in a Bill to carry that intention into effect. The Petition was referred to a Committee. A Petition was likewife prefented for the Annual Grant for fervice of the Veterinary College, UNION WITH IRELAND. The Chancellor of the Exchequer moved the Order of the Day, for the Houfe to refume the confideration of his Majefty's Meflage relative to the affairs of Ireland, in a Committee of the whole House. Sir John Sinclair faid fomething in fo low a tone that we could not diftinctly hear, but we understood that he fhould have oppofed the Speaker's leaving the Chair, had not it been an understood compact, that Gentlemen on that fide of the Houfe would not further prefs their oppofition to that point. Mr. Sheridan-Sir, I certainly do not rife for the purpose of detaining the Houfe any length of time, but I cannot agree with the Honourable Baronet that there was an understanding on the part of Gentlemen on this fide of the Hopfe, that they were not at full liberty to oppofe your leaving the Chair. I can affure the Honourable Member по no fuch agreement was entered into, and even if in kind. nefs to the friends of Union those who oppose it should have determined to leave the Minifter to reap the entire harvest of the immenfe quantity of the feeds of disunion and difaffection which had recently been fown in Ireland, ftill the Honourable Baronet ought not to confider himself bounded by a line of conduct which other individuals might think it their duty, or which it flattered their imagination to purfue. Perhaps the notion of an agreement, wonderful agreement to preferve a gloomy unreflecting filence had arifen from fome mifapprehenfion of the language held by the Right Hon. Gentleman last night. The Right Hons Gentleman with peculiar emphasis pronounced an exhortation to the Honourable Gentleman near him who fupported the queftion, that not one word fhould be uttered by any of them in anfwer to any thing which Gentlemen on his fide of the House might fay against it. It had been last night alledged, that the reason for withing to poftpone to the prefent evening the detailed proceedings in the Committee was, that Gentlemen on his fide of the House who had not spoken on the subject, might be afforded an opportunity to deliver their fentiments. Now, why did the Right Honourable Gentleman affume; was it not arrogant in him to have fuggested, that nothing would be faid by those on whose account this courteous delay was propofed, which would he worthy of notice. Honourable Gentlemen might be as much attached as they pleafed to their own fentiments, but there was fome degree of rudenefs in thus treating, unheard, the fuppofed fentiments of others. It was not poffible, that the Right Honourable Gentleman could know that certainly all occafion of debate was paft, but probably it was meant for a particular purpose to muzzle his majority. [A laugh.] The Right Honourable Gentleman had better not take this rafh ftep, for a spirit of independent loquacity might fhew itself, and delay be rendered unavoidable, by the Houfe following in his rapturous career the eloquent Chancellor of the Exchequer, or his Majefty's fagacious Secretary of State for the Home Department. But, Sir, I merely rife to fay a fingle word to two points, which have been fubject to difcuffion in the course of the measure before us. I do it before the Houfe goes into the Committee, otherwife I fhall have no opportunity, for the moment you leave the Chair I fhall leave the Houfe, and leave the Gentlemen to adjust the details of the measure juft as they please and judge proper. The firft point, Sir, is this-It has been afferted No. 23. 5 Y afferted that, during the whole courfe of debate upon this fubject no one Member has afferted that Union, abstractedly confidered, may not be good for Ireland, if it could at any future period be carried with mutual harmony and good intent. Sir, I rife moft diftinctly to contradict that, and to ftate it as my opinion, though now the attempt would be attended with multiplied dangers, yet at no time it would be a defirable meafure. That it must endanger the feparation of the kingdoms, and not increase the happiness of either, and in the end must be attended with dangers to the conftitutional liberties of both. The other point, Sir, upon which I wish to explain my fentiments is this: An Hon. Gentleman has affumed that no one has ventured directly to affert in this Houfe, that Parliament was not competent to give fanction to a Legislative Union. Sir, I have hitherto most cautiously avoided going into that topic, but at the fame time I have formed a moft decided opinion upon it. Notwithstanding all that has been faid to the contrary, I maintain there is a broad and vifible diftinction in the cafes of two Parliaments, the one incorporating, and the other furrendering its independence. I have no hesitation in faying, that I think Parliament is not competent to furrender an independent legislature, and I now publicly avow my opinion, or hereafter it may be argued upon as a thing univerfally admitted, when the queftion may be the furrender of some of our own dearest and most valuable privileges. It may be brought as an argument hereafter, when fuch admiffions may be of dangerous tendency. If it should be attempted to eftablish a distinction between right and power, it would in fact only be a difpute of words, and if right was meant, then confiftently with its duty to its conftituents, the Parli ament of Ireland have no right to commit political fuicide.It is not reconcileable to the truft upon which they hold their places. With refpect to the precedent of Scotland, which has been urged as conclufive, it has a moft diftinguishing feature; they were fummoned for the purpofe expressly of confidering and debating the fpecific queftion of Union; the Parliament of Ireland was returned to maintain and affert the rights of Irishmen in their independent Legislature. I, however, will not give my affent to add a fecond bad precedent, because there is one already exifting. But, Sir, the queftion may be put in a stronger way, in which it will come more home to the bofoms and feelings of Englishmen. Suppofe the queftion was, that we should be called upon to furrender our independence, and be united to another kingdom. What would our feelings in that cafe be? Suppose од on the marriage of Philip V. with our Queen Mary, an Union of the two kingdoms of England and Spain had been effected. Or fuppofe Prince George of Denmark, the husband of our Anne, had come to the crown of Englandwould not the ancestors of all the Honourable Gentlemen who hear me with one voice, have fpurned as a daring outrage on the rights and liberties of Englishmen, any propopofition to fend representatives either to the Parliaments of Copenhagen or Madrid; and I will ask any Gentleman, whether the answer would not have been-" No; we cannot fend Members to your Parliament, our's is an independent Parliament;-we have not the power of voting away its independence." Sir, I fhall add no more, but I thought it proper to fay thus much, that my opinions might not be mistaken. One word more, Sir, and I have done; I think all civil incapacitations on account of religious distinctions ought to be done away, and on fome future day I fhall fubmit that propofition to the House. Mr. Martin wifhed to obferve, that he should certainly not object to the Speaker's leaving the chair, unless he could be perfuaded that force was intended to be used to obtain the fanction of the Parliament of Ireland to the measure of a Legislative Union. It was faid, wait for an opportunity of tranquillity and calm; but he believed, if the Houfe waited for what was called "the proper season," the opportunity of uniting the two countries would be loft for ever. He thought that the time was favourable, indeed that the prefent was perhaps the only opportunity of faving Ireland. With refpect to what was called the final adjustment of 1782, he could not see that adjustment could at all tie up the two nations from voluntarily coming to fome farther agreement by mutual confent. He would not contend what was the language of the conftitution on such a question; but he must think there was nothing in the spirit of the conftitution to prevent any measure of accommodation on which the two countries might agree. He hoped an Union would lead to good, that it would finally be for the advantage of both nations; but he repeated it, if force should be used, no man would more strongly oppose the measure. Whilst therefore he deprecated the ufe of every kind of compulsory or indirect means, he hoped the measure would experience the mature reflection of both nations. The Speaker then left the Chair, and the House went into a Committee on the Refolutions, Mr. Douglas in the Chair. The firft refolution being read, 5Y2 Mr. Mr. Hobhoufe faid, that he gave his vote against the mo tion for the Speaker leaving the chair; for, conceiving the present to be an improper time to agitate fo delicate a quef tion as that of a legislative Union between two independent kingdoms, he wished the difcuffion might not have gone farther. He was not prepared to fay that Union would be good or not; but if the Parliament of Ireland fhould agree to it, he thought it would ftrongly recommend fuch a meafure. He fhould not, like his Honourable Friends, withdraw from the House in that stage of the business when alone the true character of the meafure was to be traced, and when the principle of those who propofed it, with their object, would be unfolded. It was not his opinion that he could perform his duty to his conftituents, if on an occafion fo folemn, and which involved every intereft of the two nations, he were to draw afide from a difcuffion in the progrefs of which it would alone be poffible for him fatisfactorily to form his opinion. He now rofe to ftate the principles upon which he had already acted, and upon which he should hereafter conduct himfelf. If the Parliament of Ireland had rejected this measure, because they were afraid that, in their prefent diftreffed circumftances, Great Britain would demand exceffive terms from them, then he would have supported the measure as a means of fhewing to the Irifh Nation the fair intention of the British Legiflature; but when, as was the cafe, the Irish Legiflature had totally rejected all confideration of the queftion, declaring that they confidered no commercial advantages as an adequate price for the furrender of their independence, then he thought it was im proper to proceed any further in the meafure. If Ireland was ready to confent to a Union, he faw no objection to it; on the contrary, he believed it was a measure which might be attended with beneficial effects to both countries. The prefent alfo might be a good plan; he was not prepared to decide upon it.-He fhould wait until it was filled up, and the outline perfected. Upon the report, or fome future ftage, he might be prepared to give his opinion. At prefent he fhould not give a vote any way. Mr. Banks ftated, that he thought the committee was the proper ftage of difcuflion for the prefent meafure, and therefore he fhould now take the opportunity. He contended that Ireland was not in a ftate to coalefce and unite with this country; from the ftate of her religious difcords and political feuds, fhe was completely distracted and diforganized. The method to remove these disorders by a Union, he |