pable of it. He could not believe that it was the intention of the Legislature to place the law and the magistracy in such a predicament a fixed form of conviction is neceffary to protect both the law and the magiftrate against the practices of those whofe trade it is to prevent the due execution of the law. It would be neceffary to pafs fome fuch bill as is propofed if it were only to correct the imperfections in the forms of convictions annexed to acts paffed during the last 40 or go years on examination it is found that they are defective in no less than fifty-three inftances or acts of Parliament, and he was affured that others might be pointed our. His Lordfhip faid it was a matter of great importance that all judicial proceedings, when the guilt is clear, fhould not be quashed for want of form. These unfeemly niceties, as Lord Hale calls them, fend many hundreds back upon fociety every year, encouraged thereby to repeat their offences.-Many offenders efcape juftice, not becaufe they are not guilty, but because there is a word too liule or a word too much, or fome technical inaccuracy in the mode of proceeding. The magiftrate, although there is not the leaft ground to fuppofe oppreli n.or ill intention on his part, and not the flightest doubt of the guilt of the offender, is liable, on the fuggeftion of perfons who are a difgrace to the profeffion of the laws, to be brought from the muft diftant part of the kingdom, from the last parith in Northumberland, before the King at Weftminster, where although the court may wish to protect the magiftrate, the proceeding muft, of course, in many inftances be quathed on account of fome mere informality; and the Judges cannot preferve the magilrate from an action of trefpafs on the part of the culprit, although the uprightnefs of the one and the guilt of the other are perfectly evident. Every circumftance fo revolting and difcouraging thould be done away, and every means to encourage men of confideration and property to undertake an office which at prefent is troublefome and difgufting in the extreme, fo much fo, that it is with difficulty gentlemen can be found to act as magiltrates, and many extenfive districts have not a fingle magiftrate: unless the dignity of the office is fupported, unless it is protected it must fall into the hands of thofe who mean to give themselves a little confequence, but who will always fuffer the culprit to efcape rather than risk a legal proceeding on the quibbles of the law, with the most worthless of its profeffors. The prefent bill does not propofe to give the Juftices, in any cafe, a power of conviction, where it was VOL. IV. 1852-3. I

not

not before given them by particular ftatutes.-It gives the advantages poffeffed by ftatures paffed within 40 or 50 years, namely, a form of conviction to thofe which paffed previoufly to that period. The purpofe of the bill is to put an end to the uncertainties and inconfiftency apparent on the face of the feveral exifting ftatutes, by fome of which it is declared, that convictions fhall not be quafhed for want of form, though no form is prefcribed-by others forms are prefcribed, but it is not declared that they thall not be quafhed for informality, and in the inftances where forms are prescribed, they appear inadequate, incomplete, and entirely different from each other. The forms in the schedule are drawn upon the principle of fhewing that in the conviction of the offender, all the rules required by the common law, for afcertaining the guilt of the accufed, have been complied with, but without explicitly stating all the minute facts and circumstances of the cafe. Claufes are inferted-firft, allowing Juftices to ufe either the form here prefcribed, the feveral forms already preferibed by existing acts, or any other form fufficient in point of law; and fecondly, exprefsly referving the right of appeal as exifting under the ftatutes: claufes are alfo added, giving the right of appeal to the Quarter Seffions, in all cafes, where the conviction is made in the form prefcribed by the schedule; and alfo, giving power to the Judge who tries any action against a Justice, in confequence of any conviction whatever, to certify on the record, that fuch Juftice had a good ground of proceeding; in which cafe a verdict thall be given for the defendant, for which fuggeftion the country is obliged to the Lord Chief Juftice of the King's Bench. He concluded by faying, it is prefumed there is nothing in the propofed bill, the leaft inconfiftent with the general principles of law for the administration of justice, and for the protection of those who adminifter it uprightly; but that, on the contrary, the regulations fuggefted will facilitate thofe purposes on which the internal peace of the kingdom fo peculiarly depends.

The bill was read a first time and ordered to be printed. The Duke of Norfolk, who had recently entered the Houfe, called the attention of their Lordships to a circumftance which he deemed to affect the privilege of Members of that House.

The Lord Chancellor, before his Grace proceeded further, obferved, that the matter was of that peculiar nature, that it was customary ftrangers thould be excluded during the

difcuffion

difcuffion he therefore propofed the order, and the strangers withdrew accordingly.

The fubject of their Lordships' deliberations was, a letter addreffed by the Rev. Mr. Brydges, claimant of the Barony. of Chandos, to the Duke of Norfolk and other Peers, adverted to by his Grace on a former evening.

The Bills before the House were forwarded in their respective stages.

Mr. Williams, from the Commiffioners of naval inquiry, prefented the fecond report from the faid Commiffioners, which was ordered to be laid upon the table.

A confiderable number of bills, of a private or local defcription, were brought up from the Commons by different members, and were feverally read a first time.

MOTION FOR CENSURING MINISTERS.

The order of the day being read, that their Lordships be fummoned to attend on this day,

-Lord Fitzwilliam rofe, according to the order of the day, to propofe his additional refolutions relative to the conduct of Minifters: he adverted to the arguments that had been ufed on the fide of Administration, on occafion of the former debate, and combated them. So far from giving fatisfaction to his mind, they had only more firmly impreffed it with the convicton, that the conduct of Miniftry had been fuch as juftly merited the cenfure which it was the object of his refolutions to fix upon it. As his Lordship only traversed the fame ground precisely which had been gone over before in the course of the former debate, it would be needless to give his fentiments in detail on the present occafion. His Lordship concluded his obfervations on the question, and the arguments which had been adduced against his propofitions, by declaring, that the effect of the whole upon his mind had been fuch as induced him to perfevere in his former intentions of fubmitting the additional refolutions to the confideration of the Houfe. These refolutions were in fubftance as follow :-" That no firm and adequate reprefentations had been made by his Majefty's Minifiers relative, to the fyftem of aggreffion, in which France had conftantly perfovered fince the conclufion of the Treaty of Amiens. That his Majefty's Minifters had, by efe means, neglected the opportunity of bringing France to fuch an explanation as would either have prevented the renewal of the war, or obliged her to difclofe her real intentions before the forces of this country had been to any confiderable degree dif I 2

banded.

banded. And that their conduct had proved of the utmost injury and detriment to the nation. Thele were, that the tenth article of the Treaty of Amiens was conftructed in fuch a way as rendered it incapable of being executed :that in these circumstances Minifters had neglected to enter, till too late, into a difcuffion with France, relative to the best mode of applying a remedy to this defect; and the confequence had been, that the question how it was to be adjufted had, by these means, produced another rupture between the two countries Refolved, "That it was the duty of his Majefty's Minifters to have made early and fpirited remonstrances against all thofe acts which constituted a series of aggreffions, infults, &c. on the part of France and by fuch reprefentations to have endeavoured to afcertain, whether their course and progrefs could have been arrested without the neceflity of recurring to force of arms. That before the determination of the French Government was afcertained, they fhould not have proceeded to a reduction of our forces; and that the neglect of fuch duties on the part of his Majelly's Minifters, was injurions to the public interefts."

There

The Duke of Clarence-" My Lords, in whatever shape. this motion has been introduced, I cannot help confidering it as a motion exprefsly made for the removal of his Majesty's Minifters. I rife, becaufe I with, my Lords, to fay, that though I differ completely from the noble Earl, yet I give him credit for his confiftency, as his motion is in the spirit, and conftitutes a part, of the system which he has uniformly purfued from the commencement of the French Revolution. are many parts of that fyitem in which I cordially agree, and which I have highly approved but the continuation of the war is not in the number. Upon that point certainly I did differ from the noble Earl, as I always thought that no opportunity thould be loft to put an end to the horrors of war, and that the chance which the state of things appeared to afford for the attainment of that end, fhould not have been rejected. Ministers, therefore, did right in making peace, notwithstanding their expectations have been fruftrated. I may be, I hope, allowed to fay, that in every debate upon the fubje&t, I always ftated, that I faw great difficulty in the Preliminary Articles et Peace, and when that difficulty was furmounted by the Definitive Treaty, though I ftill confidered the peace an experiment, its completion excited my wonder. I muit then fay, in juftice to Minifters who concluded the Treaty, that if, in 1801, ny one could have thought

that

that there was any principle of honour or juftice on the part of the Government of France, the Preliminaries were fuch as ought to have been entered into. confidering the length of the war, and the feveri y of its preffure, ought no o be cenfured for having agreed to the Preliminaries. How far in

deed they ought to have agreed to the Defini ive Treaty, is matter of ferious confideration. That is a queition which would involve the grofs mifconduct of the former Adminiftration, which brought the country into the ftate which the prefent Minifters found it. On that fabject i am ready to go into detail. Upon that ground I am ready to meet any noble Lord from the first act name y, from the embarkment of the Guards for Holland in 1793, down to the day on which the P efent Adminiftra ion came into power. Much ftrefs has been laid upon the difficulties in the way of the excution of the 10th article of the Treaty of Amien, respecting Malta. Minifters did fay they were anxious to fecure the independence of that ifland, and tha. fuch was the ob ject of the ftipulations contained in the article. Surely, then, France mult have felt the fame consciousness when the made the treaty, and that we wanted guarantees of Malta, in order that we might call upon them thould the attempt to violatę its independence. The prefent Minitters have been accufed for reducing our force. I do not admit that they did reduce it lower than was neceffary for the fatery and interent of the country. Suppofing, however, the charge to be founded in fact, it thews that Minitters were actuated by a pacific fpirit, and repels the charge which the enemy have brought againit them, of withing to renew the war. I though the pe ce at any time a matter of experiment, and in such a si uation i was impoffible to know what the amount of the fore thould be. The Parliament met, and there was one p flage in his Ma jefly's Speech which I own gave me great plea ure. not remember the exact words, but I recollect their impor welk It faid France thall not aggrandife herfelt; the thalt not pursue a fyitem of violence and encroachment with impunity, and without reftraint. We shall be prepared for our detence and for our refiftance to that fyftem, thould the attempt to perfevere in it Under thefe crircomitances, the a my eftimares were voted to an amount that had been held f.fficient for the eftablishment in any war in which the coun ry had b en ever before engaged. So far then for the charge of a too great reduction in the army. With regard to the navy, there are

I do

many