would familiarize this cafe by example. Suppofe Government here had information of a confpiracy against London, and that they had learnt the people in Kent and Surry had left their work, and were coming to London in parties; would not Government here be thought remifs if it fuffered the metropolis to be furprifed as Dublin was? He believed that the indignation of the whole town would be directed against them. Why then, he would afk, did we not feel the fame fentiment with regard to Dublin? Why thould we neglect Ireland? Could Ireland feel that Government had done its duty with regard to that part of the United Kingdom? Could the Members of that Houfe lay their hands upon their hearts and fay that they had done their duty, without calling for full information upon this fubject? Some months ago the Chancellor of the Exchequer propofed. a provifion for the Prince of Wales, and he faid the time was particularly proper for granting it, because a time of profound peace; and he made an impression upon the House, and on the Royal Exchange, that there was a probability of the peace being of long duration; but in a month afterwards a meilage came ftating armaments which indicated The danger of an invafion. So that at one day this great and profperous country was reprefented by Minifters as being free from danger, and then in a month it was reprefented as being in danger of invafion. This he called a mifreprefentation of the itate of things, and for which Minifters were refponfible, or they were culpably negligent in not procuring the neceffary information. If he was told of any great effect being produced, he naturally looked for a great caufe for it: but when he looked at the correfpondence between his Majesty's Minifters and the enemy, and found that military fpies were detected in Ireland in the beginning of the peace, under the name of Commercial Commiflioners, he would have thought that the vigilance of Minifters had been turned to Ireland. He could not account for this fort of furprife on Ministers with regard to Ireland; a lulling spell feemed to have overfpread their faculties. They feem to have been almoft petrified or rendered callous. He thould trouble the Houfe no more upon the prefent occafion, for various reafons; but he did think it ought to know the prefent circumftances of Ireland. He faw things in the newfpapers on which the Houfe ought to have information. He had heard of the declaration of the rebels. We ought to know the movements in the

North

North. In a word, he protested against the feparation under this ignorance of affairs,

Lord Caftlereagh faid, he thould fubmit to the Houfe a very few words on the fubje&t now before it. The fpeech of the hon. Gentleman who brought this matter forward was of a general nature, and embraced topics n.uch too large for the prefent mode of oifculling, for each of them would demand a feparate difcuffion before justice could be done it; fo that he fhould have little indeed to fay, it his hon. Friend (Mr. Ellio) had not brought forward fome topics of which it was his duty to take fome notice.. He though the view his hon. Friend took of this matter, divided itfelt into two points;— one, that the Executive Government were bound to give more information on the affairs of Ireland than they had given relative to the late melancholy occafion. Where his hon. Friend formed the principle or ftatefman-like motive for giving that information, he was at a lofs to know; as little was the application for this information founded on precedent in the practice of the Executive Government of Ireland; and he did not think that the precedents to be found in the practice. of the Executive Government were wholly unworthy of notice upon this occafion. He fpoke of the Executive Governments of Lord Camden and Lord Cornwallis; no Government of which he had ever known the history was placed in a fituation more difficult and critical, and extricated itfelf out of its difficulties fo well as thofe of the two noble Lords whofe names he had just mentioned, but certainly neither of thefe two Governments furnished a precedent to support the motion now before the Houfe. It was indeed true, that after the rebellion, when all treafon was put down, when individuals were brought to juftice, Government came to Parliament with all the information they puffelfed, but not until all the individuals accused of being concerned in, the rebellion had been brought to justice; this was after the danger was over, not like the prefent, where the danger was pending; and therefore, how a man of reafoning powers, and enlightend mind, could expect this motion to be agreed to, by which a full view was to be given of all that Government knew with refpect to danger, he was at a lofs, fince all reafoning was againft it, and no precedent for it. There was manifefly in this motion great danger, if the Houfe comply with it, for if Government brought forward the information now called for, the tatement would prefent

to

to the Houfe a partial account, upon which they would not endeavour to judge, because they could not judge fairly; it was therefore impoflible that this information fhould be produced without either not being relied upon at all, or if relied upon, would conduce to an unfair decifion. The Houfe would therefore not require, because it would not determine, upon information that was imperfect, and he truffed he had now fatisfied his hon. Friend himfelf, that this inquiry was improper at the prefent moment. As to what was formerly done, his hon. Friend had no ground for this motion by way of reference to former proceedings. On the former occafion the Houfe had acted on his motion for the renewal of martial law in Ireland; the ground on which he urged that fubje& was, the preffing or immediate danger that was felt at that' time, but he refted it on the foundation of a precautionary fyftem. There was no argument at that time on the subje& of the production of all information in the hands of Government; the argument then was an argument upon the inconvenience of delay, apd Parliament thought they beft dif charged their duty by granting that power to Government for a thort period, and leaving the matter to be afterwards reconfidered by Parliament when the time thould expire. The proclamation in Ireland declared that treafon had appeared in the open ftreets of Dublin, and if Parliament believed the fact, this was a foundation for their proceeding to provide for the fafety of that country by declaring martial law; for certainly, in many cafes, Parliament had acted on the notoriety of an evil, without any formal or specific communication from the Executive Government; and therefore, he trufted, his hon. Friend would no longer perfift in cenfuring Government for bringing forward the measure of martial law, without laying more information before Parliament upon this occafion. Another part of the charge that day was, the criminality of the Irish Government for not counteracting the meafures of the rebels. Upon this his Lordfhip faid, he begged to be understood as not defigning to impute to any one any improper views, yet he thought it was due to decorum, that, however willing the Executive Government might be to difcufs all matters relative to theje condu, yet it was due to decorum, not to take it up collaterally or accidentally, but that queftion of their conduct fhould be made one large general queftion, capable of embracing the whole of that conduct. Now his honourable Friend had accufed the Government of Ireland for not taking

measures

meafures of precaution; he differed from his hon. Friend upon that fubject. The amount of the daily guard in Dublin was very great. As to the garrifon not being ready to turn out immediately in the ftreets of Dublin-nothing appeared to make that a reasonable expectation in itself at the time: a body collected in that part of the town which was the scene of outrage, and in which unfortunately fell a venerable character, whofe lofs was much to be deplored, but it was a thing that might have happened to any other perfon who had become confpicuous for his virtue, and the object of hatred to the affaflins; but if this event of the murder of this elevated perfon in the open ftreet had not happened, the infurrection would not have been confidered in the ferious light in which it was confidered in confequence of that event. It was a rebellion to be fure, for the men were in arms committing a rebellicus act; but they were foon difperfed; and there was no proof whatever that Dublin was not fufficiently guarded; and he would obferve, that if the hon. Gentleman made this a charge against his Majefty's Government in Ireland, he would only obferve that this was not the proper course to be taken for that purpose; but certainly there was nothing in the nature of the rebellion in Thomas-street that demanded more force than the Government brought against the rebels. There was no proof that the arrangements made by Government on that occafion were not adequate for the purpose of protecting the city. He had gone through the two points which had been ftated against his Majesty's Government in Ireland, namely, want of information from Government to the Houfe, under the prefent circumstances, and negligence, in not providing against the mifchief. As to the general obfervations made by the hon. Gentleman, he went into much too wide a field for him to follow on the present occafion, and therefore he fhould decline it for the prefent; but as to the cenfure which had been caft on the Executive Government or Parliament of Ireland, he could not, confiftently with the fenfe he had of his duty, fit filent. He confidered that the Parliament of Ireland had fhewn itself as jealous of public liberty as any body of men had ever been, under circumstances fimilar to theirs. He obferved, that the clause which was inferted in an act of Parliament for the protection of the Magiftrates who had done their duty in fuppreffing the rebellion, was a very just and wife one. In fome cafes there had been excefs of authority, and actions were brought by perfons who had fuffered by fuch excelles.

Juries adopted in fome cafes a wrong rule of decifion, which was, by calling on the defendant in fuch actions to thew the caufe of his conduct, and find a verdict against him, if he could not do to to their fatisfaction. This introduced a complication of hardships upon magiftrates in many instances, from the very nature of the bulinefs in which they were engaged, from the death of witneffes, and a thoufand other circumftances incident to a rebellion; and many magistrates who had acted with the pureft love of their country, might have been ruined; Parliament therefore enacted, that inftead of calling on the defendant in fuch actions, to thew that he acted bona fide, the Court fhould cail on the plaintiff to prove the maus animus of the defendant before a verdict hould pafs against him, and this his Lordship maintained was an act of juftice. The noble Lord then proceeded to defend the Government of Lord Camden and Lord Cornwallis in Ireland, which he praised highly, and observed that they had been fo far from being rigorous, as fome had imagined, that they were remarkable for lenity; that the military power had never been employed, except in cafes where the civil power had been tried in vain: that if there could be any defect imputed to them, it arofe from 100 much. difpofition to lenity; but he was glad it had fo happened, because in Ireland it was most effential that the current of public opinion fhould go with Government, and that could not be the cafe unless rigorous measures were a good deal delayed; and, fpeaking in the abstract, rigorous measures had been delayed too long, but, confidering all circumstances, it was wife. As to outrages, there had been many on both fides, but there never was a rebellion without them. had no doubt that the hon. Gentleman who brought this fubject forward was perfuaded that the public intereft demanded that these topics should be raked up, and all the evils of the late rebellion brought forth anew; but he differed from the hon. Gentleman on that fubject. The distress of Ireland, which had been stated to have been general, was by no means the cafe: the statements of the diftrefs of Ireland, as well as the difpofition to rebellion, had been very much exaggerated: he would venture to affirm, no Power in Europe had made more rapid ftrides in wealth and general happiness for the last fifteen years, than that part of the British Ea pire had done. He was perfuaded that its profperity and its happiness were increafing ftill very rapidly, and that the treafon which had lately been found there, and which had VOL. IV. 1802-3.

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been