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CHAP. IX.

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Meeting of Parliament after the -New Ministry.-

Motion by Mr. Brand respecting Pledges on the part of Ministers to the King ;-negatived. - A Motion to the same Effect by the Marquis of Stafford in the House of Peers ;-negatived. -And another against the Change of Administration in the House of Commons by Mr. Lyttleton ;- negatived. Churches and Glebe Houses in Ireland.--Thanks for the Reduction of Montevideo.-Prorogation and Dissolution of Parliament.

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OTII houses of parliament met execution of the powers, with which

on Wednesday the 8th of April, he is intrusted by law to grant cerpursuant to adjournment. The ar- tain offices for life, as in the exerrangement of the new ministry cise of all the prerogatives of his was now completed, lord Eldon took crown, his conduct will at all times his seat in the house of peers, on the be governed by an anxious attention woolsack as chancellor, The new to the public interest and welfare." ministers also took their seats, on the The subject that chiefly occupied treasury bench in the house of com- the time, and interested the minds mons. About thirty new members and passions of men, for the rewere sworn in and took their seats. mainder, which was very short, of Lord G. Thynne informed the house the present parliament, was, the from the bar, that his majesty had change of administration ; the con. been waited on with the address of sideration of which drew into debate, the 25th of March, praying his what had been so often, and so majesty not to grant any office warmly agitated, the catholic ques. during life, not usually so granted; tion. In the house of commons, and that his majesty had been pleased April 9, Mr. Brand, after an introto return the following gracious ductory speech, in which he quoted answer: 6. His majesty acquaints the judgment of lord Coke respecting his faithful commons, that he will the duty of a privy counsellor, take the subject of their address into moved, "That it was contrary to the his most serious consideration; and first duties of the confidential ser. thinks it proper, at the same time, vants of the crown, to restrain them. to inform them, that he has thought selves by any pledge, express or imit fit to provide, that in a grant now plied, from offering to the king any to be made of the office of chancellor advice that the course of circum! of the duchy of Lancaster, the office stances might render necessary for shall be conferred only during his the welfare and security of any part royal pleasure.- His majesty assures of his majesty's extensive empire.” his faithful commons, that, in the Mr. Lambe rose to second the

* For a list of which, see Appendix to the Chronicle.

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motion of his honourable friend, stract proposition whatever. Many which, at the present moment, was a abstract propositions might be con. question of vital importance. Gene. sidered as incontrovertible, except ralCraufurd admitted, that ministers when they were applied to new could not bind themselves by the cases. And surely no case could pledge required, but contended, at be more new than that an admini. the same time, that his majesty could stration should lend its weight in not, constitutionally, admit of their parliament, a weight which they de. stipulation, and consequently that rived from their appointment by his their refusal to withdraw it could tere majesty, to measures which not only minate only in their dismissal from had not received the concurrence of office. The general having spoken the king, but to which his majesty long, concluded thus: “It only had expressed an absolute repugremains for me, sir, to say, that I nance ? Mr. W, would suppose a shall vote most heartily against the plain and practicable case : that some present motion; and I must make honourable gentleman, many years an ample apology to the house for ago, had moved an abstract propo. taking up so much of their time, sition, thať in any way to restrain which might have been much better the commerce of his majesty's sub. employed than in hearing me.” jects would be injurious to the

The honourable general was fol. country, and that it was the duty of lowed, on the same side of the parliament to prevent such an at. question, by Mr. Wharton, in a tempt. Such a proposition would speech distinguished, not by ver. have been good, abstractedly con. bosity, but an energetic brevity. sidered; and yet had not the legis. He objected to the motion on two lature recently restrained and abo. grounds. 1. The words in which it lished one of the most important was couched.

2. The line of argu. branches of commerce? No abstract ment which the honourable seconder proposition was more true, than had taken. As to the first, he could that it was highly criminal in sub. not compliment the honourable jects to take up arms against the mover on his discretion in intimating sovereign. But suppose that another that though ministers ought not to king James II. were to rise, would consider themselves as under the they not be justified in doing so? controul of the king, they ought to Any unconstitutional measure of the consider themselves as under the king to restore popery would justify controul of the White boys of Ireland. what would otherwise be unjustifia. With regard to the second, Mr. L. ble. Supposing that the king might seemed to have grounded his suppoft have ministers, who, by advising of the motion on the idea, that when that papists, acknowledging the noble lords and gentlemen were power of a foreign potentate, should called to the councils of his majesty, be admitted to the highest offices of they håd no power to retreat, but the state, should tacitly declare the must continue in office whether they immediate ancestors of the king would or not.-- Another point on usurpers : surely in that case his which Mr. Wharton opposed the majesty would be perfectly right in motion, was, that it was incompati. requiring from such ministers a pro. ble with the wisdom of the house to mnise that such advice should not be entertain the discussion of any abn repeated. Mr. Ord said, that if

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the late ministers had signed the ing, two subjects of consideration pledge required of them, there was before the house ; 1. Whether it was no disgrace or reproach' which they proper for them to deliberate and would not have merited. Such a come to a resolution on any abstract pledge would have made the king proposition whatever. 2. Whether absolute, and removed the responsi- they ought to recognise, by a vote, bility of ministers. Mr. Fawkes the particular proposition before also declared, that in his opinion the them. The very long debate that question was, simply, whether or ensued, or rather that was continued, not we were any longer to adhere turned much more on the catholic to the British constitution. The re- bill, the comparative meritor demerit sponsibility of ministers was the se- of rival administrations, and other curity of the privileges of this extraneous matter, than on the ques. country. If those ministers were tions, or twofold question, imme. no longer free agents, if they tied diately or properly before the house. themselves down to give that advice Instead, therefore, of pursuing the to the crown only, which should be debate in the order of a great variety palateable to it; in what a state of of different speakers on different danger might the country be speedily topics, we shall follow the thread of placed! He was astonished, he discourse on Mr. Brand's motion and was terrified at the language of the Mr. Osborne's amendment: after present day on this subject. Such which we shall take notice of such was not the language which pre- parts of the extraneous matter, (which, vailed at the time of our great de. though not precisely relevant to the liverer, when the great councils of question, was yet not unnaturally the nation recommended to him to connected with it.) as appear most dismiss his Dutch guards, and when striking and important. a refusal on his part, might have re- Sir Samuel Romilly said, that the produced those scenes which had question now before the house, was deluged the country with blood. one which involved most important Mr. Osborne was entirely of the constitutional doctrines :

it was same opinion with Mr. Wharton. highly interesting to the people at Leaving to others the discussion of large, and as interesting to the the measure, to the rash introduction sovereign himself as to any of his of which the late ministers owed subjects : and it was a question their dismissal, he determined to give which, although it contained an ab. every assistance in his power to the stract proposition, was necessary maintenance of the constitution in to be brought before the house, bea church and state, and seeing no ne- cause it referred to a principle that cessity whatever for the recognition had been recently acted upon.of the abstract principle proposed, The true question before the house, ondeavonred to get rid of it, “ by was, whether or not it was constia moving that the other orders of the tutionally justifiable, or rather, day be now read.” Mr. Bastard, whether it was not a high crime and who never approved the discussion misdemeanour, in any minister in the of abstract principles, seconded the confidence of his majesty, to submotion.

scribe to a pledge, that he would not There were now, properly speak, offer to his majesty any advice that 3

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might appear to him to be essential a confidential adviser of a man whom to his interests. He could not help that house had declared to have been thinking, that this was a matter of guilty of a gross violation of the law; more importance to the king than to a person against whom certain reso. any of his subjects. That the king lutions had been entered on the could do no wrong, he understood journals of that house a person who to be a maxim in which the security had been brought to trial ; who had of the public, and that of the honour been acquitted indeed, but so acand dignity of the crown, were quitted, that not any of his nume'. united, and on which both these rous and powerful friends had ever points materially depended. For yet attempted to make a motion for by this sort of pledge, the whole rescinding those resolutions from the nature of the responsibility of state journals; one who had indeed been affairs would be taken away. There acquitted by a majority of his peers, would be no security against the but who couldnot return to that house, most traitorous intentions of irre, without reading, from the association sponsible advisers, For ministers of ideas in the countenances of those would not be answerable, and could who sat near and opposite to him, the not be answerable for advice which words which they-and there were they did not give. And they could 52 of them had uttered of him ; not give that which they stood " Guilty upon my honour.” The pledged to withhold. This matter king might call to his councils whom was the more alarming, that in the he pleased, but that act must be opinion of the chancellor of the done by advice, and the adviser exchequer, there were cases wherein must be responsible. If it was his majesty acted without any advice allowable for ministers to exclude whatever*.-It had been said, that themselves from giving advice on one the present motion tended to bring subject, they might go on with ex. his majesty to the bar of that house. clusions till they left themselves no There was no desire whatever to in. duty to exercise. It was,

however, volve his majesty in any censure of the greatest importance to his for what had been done. Nor had majesty, that the doctrine of respon. the present motion any such ten- sible advisers should be strictly dency. On the contrary, it had a maintained. History had unfolded direct tendency to protect the king, the evils resulting from the prevaby supporting the maxim that he lence of a contrary principle. It could do no wrong; which could had been asserted by the mover of Dever be done by allowing any of the previous question, that ministers his ministers to enter into a pledge had not entered into any pledge, not to offer him advice on any given that they would not give his majesty subject. Unquestionably his majesty any advice on the subject of the might call any man in the kingdom catholics. Now as the late ministers to his councils, or be might make were dismissed because they refused

* The words of Mr. Perceval referred to, and quoted by sir S. Romilly were, "That to the best of his knowledge and belief, the king had no adviser on the point of requesting the pledge-that he did not believe the king had any adviser, and that bę did not think the country would believe that the king had any adviser on that point.

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this p'edge, either the pledge on the by whom he had been advised to part of the present ministers was demand the pledge alluded to in the implied, or they had deceived his debate, or to dismiss his late minimajesty : for it was not pretended sters, and that the answer to such that his majesty had any objection address should be, that his majesty to his late ministers, except the had no adrisers in either case; what difference of opinion which occurred would follow ? why, that blame would on this subject.

fall on a quarter to which according Mr. Bathurst admitted that there to the constitution, no blame ought was no act of the crown without to be imputed. Thus, by this responsibility, generally speaking: motion, the maxim that the king but yet there were some exceptions could do no wrong, essential to the to that proposition, and among the constitution, because essential to first to be admitted, was that where the power and importance of the his majesty had no advisers. Such monarchy, might be exploded. was the case when he had removed Sir Patrick Murray, in his first his ministers; and unless the ex. speech in parliament, fully agreed ception to responsibility was to be in the just and constitutional senallowed in that case, the king's pre. timents which the house had just rogative of choosing his own mini- heard.—But before he proceeded to sters must be nugatory. But, it animadvert on the motion before the was stated, the proposition before house, he thought it necessary to the house was a truism. That was advert to the remarks of an honour. admitted. But was there any ne

able and learned gentleman respectcessity for that house to come to any ing a subject, which he had chosen public resolution in support of that to bring into consideration, although truism ? Although the right of the not at all connected with the monoble lord to explain his conduct in tion.—The honourable baronet con. the transaction which led to the tended that it was not necessary to present motion might be admitted, move the resolutions of that house still the propriety of making that ex. respecting the noble lord referred planation a ground of a parliament. to (Melville), after he had been acary proceeding, might be consistently quitted at the tribunal before which denied. For himself, he could not he was tried, any more than it would but regret, that a question of this be to propose expunging an informa. nature should be submitted to the tion at law from the record, after house, because it evidently involved the subject of that information had the discussion of the conduct of the been acquitted. But what, it had king, whose name could not, con- been said, or insinuated, signified sistently with the practice of the an acquittal, where so many of the house, be introduced on any such judges voted for conviction? What, occasion. - So much for the necessity however would those gentlemen say, of the motion. It was also to be if in the case of an opposite issue, considered, what consequenees were the converse of the proposition were likely to flow from its adoption. taken? Suppose the majority of Suppose, as one of the consequences, lords had voted for the conviction of his majesty should be called on by lord M., and a number equal to the an address of that house, to state, minority on that occasion, had rated

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