violated every article of it in Europe? Martinique, however, was gone, this bulwark was lost to us, perhaps, for ever. Orders were also sent out to surrender the Cape and it was only a matter of accident if it was not so. He should be curious to learn the date of the subsequent orders sent out for its detention; because it would shew that if it escaped the folly of their conduct, it was by accident only that it was preserved. Malta, however, was still in our hands, and he rejoiced in the fact. We were indebted for its safety to one of the blunders which had marked their administration. Oh! that all their blunders had been equally fortunate! They had made an arrangement for Malta which never could be executed, and it was only because their own contrivances was incapable of being executed that we were now in possession of that invaluable post. The noble lord concluded his most spirited and vehement animadversion on ministry by saying, that a sense of duty to his King and Country had compelled him to express his sentiments of their conduct. He had never been one of those whom they had duped into the conviction that we might enjoy even a little delusive tranquillity. He knew that a nation like Great Britain ought never to buy protection by sacrifices and concessions. All history, and even the history of our nation, was against such a step. When our ancestors poorly bribed the Danes with money to return to their hones, they laid out the sums in the purchase of ships to return to the attack. We were now trying the same experiment on a larger scale, and he was confident it would be with the same result. Every fresh concession we made to France operated in a double sense to weaken us, and to strengthen her. All these successive sacrifices tended not at all to soften her animosity, but operated largely indeed in increasing her means of hostility. Let us not delude ourselves with the idea that the alternative of peace or war is in our own choice. We might, if we chose it, still consider ourselves as at peace with Franee, and it belonged not to him to decide this question in the present moment under all the disadvantages and weakness which the conduct of government had brought upon us. But whether we did so or not, France was not an iota the less at war with us. She was so now, and she had constantly been so from the signature of the preliminaries to the present hour. She looked invariably to the subversion of our government, and the destruction of our country, nor could we even console ourselves with the shameful hope, which had, he feared, operated in some parts of Europe, that if the independence of the state were subdued, yet our private properties might be saved, and our personal ease secured. If the examples of so many other countries were good for nothing else, they might at least teach us to renounce this hope. And we must eternally keep in mind this truth that though we might be at peace with France, France was actually at war with England; as much so as if the declaration of war had been made; perhaps she might choose, indeed, to call the speech of this day a declaration of war. If she did so, it could not make us worse. We must exert ourselves; we must strain every nerve; we must struggle for an existence; by wisdom and vigilance, by measures of extensive and active preparation, and by a tone of firmness and decision supported by a conduct correspond. ing with it, even peace might, in his opinica, be still obtained and enjoyed from this very hour. Not a nominal, dishonourable, and ruins truce, but real peace founded in a sense of our dignity, supported by a knowledge of our own strength, and maintained by the respect which our conduct would then create abroad, and ty the confidence it would inspire at home. Bu he had no hesitation in saying, that if we meast to make that struggle effectual, it must not be under the auspices of the present persons in of hice. No; not under such men. There was but one man in the kingdom, to whom every eye was directed-to whom every heart was at tracted, as alone equal to rally the national force -as alone equal to weather the storm. LORD PELHAM said, that was not the proper time to go into a detail of the nature and extent of the intended augmentation of the force of the kingdom; he hoped, therefore, that ha silence upon the subject would not be construed into an assent to the construction that had been put by the Noble Lords over the way (Lrd Grenville and Carlisle) upon that part of au Majesty's speech; but thus much he would say, that no sudden or great augmentation of the troops was intended, nor did there appear any thing in the state of Europe that made such an augmentation necessary. With regard to the part of the Noble Lord's reasoning which p plied to the indemnities assigned to the diferest states of Germany, his Ldp. said, he could no think this country had any justifiable cause ra interfere, so long as the several states in question were satisfied themselves with the indemnities allotted to them. LORD CARYSFORT said, he was sorry to learn from the noble Secretary of State, that they were not likely to be gratified with that essen tial augmentation, which the critical situation of the empire indispensably required. It was t doubtedly a solemn and a serious thing to engage in war, and the noble Secretary of State would not be justified in unnecessarily plunging the country into a renewal of hostilities, but there might occur circumstances which might make such a measure unavoidable. His Ldp. drew the distinction between peace and war being consi dered as experiments. War, he admitted, to be an experiment, because the events of a wat were uncertain; but peace, he contended, was not an experiment, but a matter of certainty. He declared he was astonished to hear the noble Secretary of State talk so lightly of the distriba tion of territory in Germany. Was it a ma of no importance to this country to have de means of carrying on her commerce with seca rity? Did they not know, that from the mouth of the Ens, to the Bay of Trieste, we had pr single fort in our possession? The North of Germany appeared to him to be of the highest importance to the commercial interests of this country. LORD HOBART rose to complain of the injustice of Ld. Grenville, in censuring the King's servants, on account of the dismemberment of Germany, when he could not but know that the treaty of Luneville was made during that Noble Lord's administration; and that Germany was brought into its present condition by circum. stances which were not subject to the controul of any ministers. It was enough for him to say, that the indemnities in Germany were not considered as of sufficient importance to prevent its making peace. The Noble Lord stood up to charge his Majesty's servants with incapacity; it did not become him, (Lord H.) to say one word in answer to such a charge; he only desired that the present administration might be judged by its conduct; but he would tell that Noble Lord, that he could not charge the present ministers with incapacity, without at the same time criminating himself for having relinquished his post. HOUSE OF COMMONS, Tuesday, Nov. 23. The Speaker having read his Majesty's Speech, (for which see p. 690.) Mr. TRENCH rose to move an address of thanks to his Majesty. In viewing our internal situation, he should advert first to those sources of prosperity which were more immediately within our own reach; and in this view of our situation, there appeared to be the greatest cause for exultation. Whether they turned their eyes to the attachment displayed by all ranks of the people to the constitution of this country, in the most trying situations. Whether they looked to the increasing revenue of the empire, or to the improved state of its agriculture, manufactures, and commerce, in every point of view there was the greatest reason for congratulation and triumph. In looking at the state of our commerce, we should no where find the verification of those melancholy, those sinister predictions which were made by some gentlemen, that our commerce, though great during the war, would decline at the peace. Instead of being injured, our resources remained, not only unimpaired, but improved, after exertions almost greater than imagination could conceive. Under these circumstances, every one must undoubtedly wish for the continuance of peace; but yet we had no reason to apprehend the event of a war, if war was necessary for the security of the country. It would be unnecessary for him to enter into any argument to shew the necessity of our keeping an eye upon the measures adopted on the continent, because it was a proposition recognised by the last parliament, in its address to the throne on the conclusion of the peace. That events which had occurred on the continent had deinonstrated a great disposition to encroachment on the part of France, and naturally excited some degree of jealousy, could not be denied. But in what manner and at what point we ought to interfere, or whether we ought to interfere withVOL. II. out concert with other powers, were quesitons upon which it was impossible for them to decide without a greater knowledge than they possessed. He sincerely hoped that peace might be maintained; but if the honour, the independence, and the security of this country required measures of an opposite nature, he was sure ministers would not want the hearty co-operation of the whole empire. Mr. CURZON rose to second the Address. He congratulated the House upon the flourishing state of the trade, the manufactures, and the commerce of this country. He perfectly concurred with the honourable mover of the address, upon the importance of preserving peace, if peace could be preserved consistently with our honour and dignity. Mr. CARTWRIGHT said, the best way to preserve the blessings of peace, was to shew, that, if necessary, we were prepared for a state of war. When he considered the conduct of the person at the head of the govt. of France since the conclusion of the treaty of peace; how little pacific he had shewn himself since that period, and how much pains he had taken to irritate the feelings of this country, it certainly could not be denied that we ought to put ourselves in a state of readiness. He said, that ministers had been much to blame in disarming so quickly as they had done; in doing so they had deviated froin the conduct of all former ministers upon former ocasions. They had always taken care at least to provide a force equal to that of France; instead of which, if we were now to go to war, he doubted if we had a fleet equal to that of the enemy; because, since the peace they had constantly been increasing their force, and we had been decreasing ours. But the stronger his feelings were with regard to the conduct of France, the more he lamented the loss of those great talents which had so long watched over the interests of this country, and had so successfully counteracted the efforts of France against her; he could not help lamenting the loss of the abilities of the right hon. gent. he alluded to, because he was convinced that there never was a time at which this country stood more in need of those talents than it did at present. Sir J. WROTTESLEY said, that he felt himself called upon to take a short review of the conduct of ministers, and in so doing, he should follow the example of the hon. gent, who moved the Address. The hon. mover of the Address had dwelt upon the improved state of our manufactures; he was sincerely glad to hear that statement from the hon. gent. because we should, perhaps, soon see the moment when it would be necessary to call all the resources of the country into action. He was sorry, however, to observe, that the state of the manufactures, in the part of the country to which he belonged, was not such as to justify the hon. gent.'s assertion. There were many important topics upon which the hon. mover of the Address had very wisely touched but lightly, and his doing so, must have been a matter of satisfaction to those who sat 4 H under him. Very soon after the signing of the treaty of peace, ininisters found that the spirit of the govt. of France was not such as they could approve. France had dictated to the empire on the subject of indemnities, she had lately annexed the Duchy of Parma to her overgrown dominion. We had seen the glorious achievements of the patriots of Switzerland to establish the liberty of their country, frustrated by France, and that, without any known remonstrance on the part of this country. Fle did not know what the conduct of ministers had been upon this subject, but he knew that Switzerland had been over-run by a large French army; he knew that the best people of that country were in the power of the Consul of France, sharing perhaps the same fate as the unfortunate Tous saint, lying in a dungeon. In this gloomy prospect, he saw but one dawn of hope, and that was, the calling forth again the greatest abilities in this country: they had saved this country in times of the greatest difficulty and danger, and might still save it. Mr. PYTCHES said, he should consider the Speech which had been read, as the speech of the minister; and considering it in that point of view, he had no difficulty in pronouncing it a Complete Salmagandi. He was convinced that the French govt. had no intention of violating the peace with this country. Mr. Fox-Some expressions, Sir, which fell from the hon. move of this Address, as well as from two hon. gent. under the gallery, make it necessary for me to trouble the House with a few observations, explaining the grounds of the vote which I shall give, and which will be a vote of direct and cordial approbation to the Address. Before 1 proceed I will just say a few words respecting an expression in the Address, which may appear to stand in need of explanation, consistent with the principles on which I shall have the honour of voting on the present occasion. The expression to which I refer is that which pledges the House to make provision for the support of such an establishment as may fully provide for the national security, and while an ardent desire for peace is cultivated, assures his Majesty of cordial co-operation in vindicating the national interests and honour from the attacks of any foreign foe. As I understand the expression, it conveys to his Majesty no pledge which has not my fullest approbation, and it is only in consequence of an observation made use of by the hon. mover of the Address, that I consider it proper to advert to it. The hon. gent. let fall some hints about the necessity of keeping up a large establishment; but by the vote which I shall now give, 1 protest against any such inference; and certainly I do not, by agreeing to the Address, bind myself to the support of any establishment of this nature. Those who think that the peace of the country will be best maintained, and its security supported, by such an establishment, will understand the expressions in the Address in the sense which the hon. mover attaches to but I, who think that these objects them would be best promoted by a small military esta. blishment, whether with the view of preserving the peace, or of renewing the war, do not mean, by agreeing to the Address, at all to preclude myself from canvassing any estimates which will hereafter be laid on the table. Neither the Speech, nor the Address, indeed, speak of the extent of the establishment, but very properly speak of the subject generally, leaving the details to form the ground of future arrangement. I have thought it necessary to say these few words on this point, to prevent any misconcep tion from applying to the opinion, which at a future time I may feel it my duty to submit to the House, when the extent of the establishment to be maintained comes regularly under consideration. Now, Sir, as to the observations of the two gent. to whom I have alluded, I think that they were introduced in rather a singular way. One hon. gent. (Sir J. Wrottesley) thinks that the language and spirit of the Speech are too pacific; but unfortunately the hon. gent.is not very consistent in his remarks, for he finds, in the conclusion of the Speech, a language em, ployed which seemed designed to prepare the House and the public for an immediate renewal of hostilities. He is displeased at ministers far stating to the House a determination to watch with jealousy the changes in the relative situa tion of foreign powers, and asks what right this country has to interfere in the affairs of Sw zerland, since they knew of similar acts on the part of France at the time the treaty of peace was concluded, and made no remonstrances the subject? Such is the inconsistency of the hon. gent.'s observations, which appear to be introduced only for the purpose of blaming m nisters, when no ground of blame existed. The other hon. gent. is offended with the represe tation given in the speech of the flourishing statt of our commerce and manufactures: he say that in the part of the country with which he a connected, the case is quite otherwise; and cer tainly, Sir, on such a subject the hon. gent's opinion deserves very great consideration. For myself I shall give no opinion on the subject. I hope the hon. gent is mistaken; but whateve: be the case, of this I am certain, that there s only one wish in the House and the Country, that our internal situation should be such as ty the Speech it is described. Undoubtedly the are circumstances in the state of Europe wh cannot fail to excite considerable alarm; bl hope there is no reason to be alarmed about the prosperity of our manufactures and commerce. Admitting, however, for the sake of argument, that they had suffered decay, I hope no one ca for a moment conceive the absurd idea that we could better our commercial and manufactur interests by plunging again into war.-Wat regard to the objections to the Address, they will be considered in a different way by different sides of the House. Those who defended the treaty of peace, when it was laid before the House, will defend it still on the same pra ples which originally induced them to ge their approbation, and they will naturally pra the objections to the Address as frivolous and more profound tranquillity; there never was a inconclusive. Those, on the other hand, who time when every consideration of the soundest contended that they would not have made peace policy more strongly suggested the propriety of on the terms which the treaty contained, will cultivating the continuance of peace. Without be anxious to break a peace which they would referring to the calamities of the last ten years, not have made, and to renew a war which they I ask gent. fairly, whether in pursuing this powished to continue. But it may be said, that licy the country ever had more fair play?. war would not now be renewed on the same There are some persons who affect to entertain principles on which it was formerly prosecuted, a dread of the French navy; but it is hardly pos and that new causes of war had accrued since sible to believe any one serious in indulging any the treaty of peace was concluded. I cannot alarm on this subject. As to the acts of the appeal to the House, for the decision took place French govt. indicating a spirit of hostility to in a former Parliament, but I can appeal to the interests of this country, I shall at present many gent, who now hear me, to consider what say nothing. They are not now before the the principles were on which they approved the House, and may be better animadverted on at peace, and whether any thing has taken place another time, if any real ground of complaint since the treaty was concluded which would actually existed. It is my own firm conviction authorize them to give their vote on the present that there is on the part of the French people, occasion for breaking the treaty and recom- as well as the French govt. a strong desire to remencing hostilities. Supposing for a moment store their commerce to new activity, and their that war was to be renewed, gent. would do well manufactures to new life; and this, I believe, to reflect in what manner hostilities would be is the field in which, if any contest is to be carconducted. On this part of the subject I will ried on betwixt the two countries, they wish the not go into detail; but supposing that a deter- dispute to be conducted. Of the result of such mination were taken to renew the war, it is ob- a rivalship, we have, Sir, surely very little room vious that our means of annoying the enemy for apprehension. We have got so much the would consist simply in re-taking the places start of them, that we must take the lead; and, which by the treaty we had agreed to cede, or if they had the start of us, our superiority is so in retaining those still in our hands.-Now, Sir, great that we could not fail speedily to overtake I say distinctly, that to violate the treaty of peace them. In this contest we should be certain of for such an object as this (and under the present victory, and every intermediate step in our procircumstances there is no other object which gress would only afford new facilities for incould be obtained) would be to place the minis- creasing our superiority, and augmenting our ters of this country and the members of the improvement. It would be absurd, indeed, to last parl. who had approved of the treaty in a pretend that this fair prospect will not be marsituation to excite the ridicule of all Europe. The red; but of this I am perfectly convinced, that it continuance of peace, I do contend, is infinitely must be a very strong case which would justify desirable; I feel its importance in the strongest the recommencement of hostilities, instead of manner. Adverse, however, as I am to the re-employing our resources in cultivating the arts newal of hostilities, I do not mean to assert that of peace. Is there a man in this House or in no circumstances may have followed the peace this country who, after the disasters which have which would fully justify ministers for refusing been sustained during the progress of a wild and to comply with its provisions. I am not ashamed, destructive contest, would, without continental Sir, to avow an opinion for which I have not un-support, again renew a contest with France, frequently been exposed to ridicule, and now without any support but that derived from the explicitly to declare, that I consider the preser-co-operation of a few German princes, whose vation of national honour to be almost the only legitimate cause of war. This doctrine I hold on the plain principle, that honour is directly and inseparably connected with self-defence. If it can be proved to me that the national honour has been insulted, or the national dignity disgraced, I will, without hesitation, declare my opinion, which is, this would be a fair legitimate cause of recommencing hostilities.- must, however, hear a very strong case made out, before I can give my vote for re-plunging the country in those disasters which a calamitous contest had produced, and from which we were so recently delivered. Though I contend that honour is the only legitimate foundation of war, I do not mean to deny that other circumstances may come in aid of its force. As to the present circumstances of Europe, I see no ground of war, so far as this country is concerned. There never was a period, Sir, in which this country enjoyed more internal prosperity, or troops might be subsidised to engage in our cause? I trust that so extravagant a project will not again be adopted; if, contrary to every suggestion of expediency, and every dictate of policy, it should be embraced, it requires little political sagacity to foresee that the result will be incalculably disastrous. The first and grand object which we ought to have in view is security, but there can be no true security which is not upheld by honour. There can be no true dignity which is not supported by character. An hon. gent. however, finds a new ground of war in the character of the French govt. He is surprised to find it not so friendly or conciliating as he expected at the time the treaty was concluded. Did the hon. gent. Sir, really expect that the French govt. was henceforth to entertain to wards this country no feelings but those of friendship? Did he imagine that we might expect from it every interchange of civility and kindness; that our govt. would find in it a powerful and dis contriving something to excite the curiosity of their readers. I do believe in my conscience that the people of this country are, at this mo ment, as eager to cultivate the blessings of peace, as at any former period. Mankind, Sir, have been too often sacrificed to the ambition of princes, and to the intrigues of parties; but if the pub interested ally? If such were the hon. gent's.ideas, I confess myself at a loss to know on what they were grounded. There was certainly nothing in the language employed at the time when the merits of the treaty were under discussion, to countenance this supposition. The very reverse was the impression which every part of the discussion was calculated to inspire. By those highlishers of newspapers are to be the means of in office a very different prospect was held out to plunging the nation again into a destructive conthe House and the Country. A Noble Lord op- test, it will be the most base and ignoble cause posite (Ld. Hawkesbury) made use of a very re- in which ever a people was engaged. But we markable expression when describing the situa- are told that a most considerable body in this tion in which the peace left us with relation to country are strongly actuated with a desire that the other powers of Europe. He said that the the war should be renewed. The class to which continent was in a 66 very unsatisfactory state," I allude, are the commercial interests in all the a sort of language certainly by no means calcu- capital trading towns throughout the country, lated to suggest any ideas of friendship or cor- but more especially in the metropolis. To this diality on the part of the French govt. The representation I am not disposed to give my aimmense aggrandisement of French influence sent. The merchants in this country are too and French power is doubtless a subject of deep liberal, and too respectable a body of men to regret, and no man laments it more than I do. have any wish to replunge their country into a It must be lamented by every Englishman; and those calamities, from which she has just began this very aggrandisement is with me a grand to emerge, from any hope of gain arising from cause of accusation against the late ministers, by contracts with govt., or from any of the other whose obstinacy and misconduct it was obtained. means of emolument which spring out of a state But, Sir, let gentlemen who hold this language of war, and which to one class are the sources of reflect, that with the knowledge of the conti-aggrandizement, while to the community they nent being in the state which the Noble Lord de- are only pregnant with misery. If, however, scribed, the treaty of peace had received the ap- the fact is as gent. represent it, I should fee probation of the House and the Country. Who disposed almost to wish the reverse of those ages was not aware that she power of France was in- of splendid achievement which distinguished creased to a degree which naturally excited jea- the history of antiquity. If human beings ar lousy on the part of this country; who did not to perish to gratify any passion of our nature, [ take this into his contemplation when called upon should rather that their blood should flow to gr to give his vote upon the merits of the treaty of tify the romantic ambition of Alexander, that peace! No one pretends that this was not to fill the coffers of a cold calculating body of known; but knowing this, seeing this, stating unfeeling merchants; let us not be accused, Sir, this, it is impossible for any rational man to of a wish to renew those disasters which for tes deny that these causes for war, drawn from the years have desolated Europe, to open afresh the state of the continent, which were now so much wounds which have so long afflicted suffering ba insisted upon, were known at the time when the manity; let us not disturb the peace of the c treaty of peace was sanctioned-and to hold tinent when our interference could produce n them up now as grounds of renewing the contest beneficial effect. When there is not a singe betwixt the two countries, was equally impolitic power ready to second our efforts, let us at f and unjust. There indeed remains a question a rash step forfeit those blessings which are inhow far the state of the continent, in conse-dispensably and eternally connected with a state quence of intermediate events, was more unsa- of peace. Great enterprises, which might tisfactory thin at the time when peace was con- my opinion with much more propriety be sty cluded. These acts, whatever their nature may rash actions, are flattering in prospect, but th be, are not now before the House, and there-astrous in the result, spelæta eventu tristia. We fore I shall not now speak to them. A great are now in a state of domestic tranquillity, deal has been said, Sir, about the disposition flattering internal prosperity, and when our cat of the people of this country in favour of a re- merce, as far as the nature of human affairs ju newal of the war. This, I have no hesitation tifies anticipation, might become daily more ex in affirming to be completely false. Of all the ficti- tended. There is one other point, Sir, on whic tious crimes which ever were imputed to the peo- I shall make one or two observations. At ple of England, and certainly they have often been commencement of the late war, the House, accused of crimes of which they were incapable, I believe, I may add, the Country, were a even in thought, I do pronounce this to be one were hurried into the contest by the expect a of the most groundless that ever was invented to that the struggle was one which would not injure the national character. The origin of arduous during its continuance, or protracted in this calumny it is not difficult to trace, It arises, its duration. Fatal experience has, however, Sir, from the coalition of some newspapers, who sufficiently demonstrated the fallacy of se affect to hold out this as the real disposition of anticipations. I hope, Sir, we shall not aga the people. Their motives for such representa- be hurried into any new war on the expectatita tions may be various. They may wish to gra- of its only lasting one campaign. If we agtit tify spleen, or to increase their circulation, by engage in war, it is surely matter of importaret |